90.9 WBUR - Boston's NPR news station
Top Stories:
PLEDGE NOW
Week In The News: Obama On Economy, Weiner, Royal Baby

Obama on the economy. Anthony Weiner exposed again. A royal baby. Our weekly news roundtable goes behind the headlines.

New York mayoral candidate Anthony Weiner, left, listens as his wife, Huma Abedin, speaks during a news conference on July 23, 2013, in New York. The former congressman says he's not dropping out of the New York City mayoral race in light of newly revealed explicit online correspondence with a young woman. (Kathy Willens/AP)

New York mayoral candidate Anthony Weiner, left, listens as his wife, Huma Abedin, speaks during a news conference on July 23, 2013, in New York. The former congressman says he’s not dropping out of the New York City mayoral race in light of newly revealed explicit online correspondence with a young woman. (Kathy Willens/AP)

A royal baby and Anthony Weiner’s shamlessness ate up the air time this week. But there was much more.  Egypt, moving dangerously again.  Congress, in a narrow, hard fought vote to sustain NSA surveillance.  A huge, top hedge fund indicted on insider trading.  A stopgap vote on student loans.  Attorney General Eric Holder moves to keep a grip on Texas voting.  A train goes fatally off the rails in Spain.  The pope goes to Brazil. And the president makes his case, again, for the middle class in U.S. economy.

This hour, On Point: Our weekly news roundtable goes behind the headlines.

– Tom Ashbrook

Guests

Annie Lowrey, economic policy reporter for The New York Times. (@AnnieLowrey)

Major Garrett, chief White House correspondent for CBS News and Correspondent-at-Large with the National Journal. (@MajorCBS)

Jack Beatty, On Point news analyst.

From Tom’s Reading List

The New York Times: Obama Focuses on Economy, Vowing to Help Middle Class: “In speeches in two small college towns in the Midwest, Mr. Obama lamented that typical Americans had been left behind by globalization, Wall Street irresponsibility and Washington policies, while the richest Americans had accumulated more wealth. He declared it “my highest priority” to reverse those trends, while accusing other politicians of not only ignoring the problem but also making it worse.”

The Washington Post: Anthony Weiner’s Sexual Behavior May Have Underlying Issues: “But doctors, clinical psychologists and sex therapists differ on the role of biology, as well as issues such as anxiety, depression and insecurity.”

USA Today: Worst Spain Train Crash In Decades: “Officials said initially that the crash, which occurred on the eve of a local Christian festival, appeared to be an accident, not terrorism.”

BBC: Royal Baby: Why George Alexander Louis?: “Of the three names, it is the significance of the third that is most obvious. Louis immediately makes one think of Louis Mountbatten, uncle of Prince Philip and last viceroy of India, who was killed by the IRA in a bomb attack on his yacht.”

Video

On Wednesday, July 24, a high-speed train derailed in Spain, killing more than 70:

Also on Wednesday, President Obama spoke at University of Central Missouri about education and the economy:

Please follow our community rules when engaging in comment discussion on this site.
  • Wm_James_from_Missouri

    217 American traitors voted to usurp your Constitutional Rights of protection against unreasonable search and seizure because it was convenient for them to do so. They have labeled you a criminal. What is next ? Will they take away your right of free speech, or your guns. Maybe they will reinstitute the practice of slavery. Then again, maybe they will just take your children from you so that they can put them in upgraded forms of Maoist retraining camps. This time it won’t be about communism, it will just be about serving them. Even our so called Liberal and Constitutionally trained lawyer President supports this garbage !!

    You know, right now all I can think of is a line from the movie, Godfather 2, were Michael Corleone tells his brother Fredo, “I know it was you, Fredo. You broke my heart. You broke my heart.”

    —————————–

    “Report: Postal Service Uses ‘Spying’ Programs Similar to NSA”

    “Approximately 160 billion envelopes, packages and postcards were photographed by the United States Postal Service last year, reports The New York Times.

    It was done as part of the Mail Isolation Control and Tracking program, according to The Times, in which Postal Service computers take pictures of the exterior of every piece of mail that passes through the system.

    It’s one of two programs The Times says shows that postal mail is under similar surveillance to phone calls and emails by the National Security Agency.”

    From:

    http://www.ktva.com/news/local/Report-Postal-Service-Uses-Spying-Programs-Similar-to-NSA-214289001.html

    —————————–
    “Internet Activists Rally Support to Defund NSA Phone Surveillance”

    Amendment to H. R. 2397 As Reported
    Offered By Mr. Amash Of Michigan

    http://mashable.com/2013/07/23/internet-activists-call-for-defunding-the-nsa-ahead-of-congress-vote/?utm_campaign=Mash-Product-RSS-Pheedo-All-Partial&utm_cid=Mash-Product-RSS-Pheedo-All-Partial&utm_medium=feed&utm_source=rss

    • Wm_James_from_Missouri

      “Mail Isolation Control “

      M*I*C        K*E*Y                M*O*U*S*E

      Everybody sing !

      Boy, ya know, that 2 billion dollar Bluffdale Utah, spy center, along with the projected 40 million dollar, per month, electric bill, sure could have went a long way to helping those very needy children at St. Jude’s Hospital, no ?

    • alsordi

      An even better line from the GodFather is when Michael tells his family he joined the marines, and Sonny tells him “don’t be a chump”.   

      Sonny must have read Colonel Smedley Butler’s book written back in the 30′s.  War is a Racket.

  • Wm_James_from_Missouri

    How they voted !

    From:

    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2013/roll412.xml

    FINAL VOTE RESULTS FOR ROLL CALL 412

     
    H R 2397 RECORDED VOTE 24-Jul-2013 6:51 PM
    AUTHOR(S): Amash of Michigan Amendment No. 100
    QUESTION: On Agreeing to the Amendment

     
    Ayes Noes PRES NV
    Republican 94 134 6
    Democratic 111 83 6
    Independent
    TOTALS 205 217 12

    —- AYES 205 —

    Amash
    Amodei
    Bachus
    Barton
    Bass
    Becerra
    Bentivolio
    Bishop (UT)
    Black
    Blackburn
    Blumenauer
    Bonamici
    Brady (PA)
    Braley (IA)
    Bridenstine
    Broun (GA)
    Buchanan
    Burgess
    Capps
    Capuano
    Cárdenas
    Carson (IN)
    Cartwright
    Cassidy
    Chabot
    Chaffetz
    Chu
    Cicilline
    Clarke
    Clay
    Cleaver
    Clyburn
    Coffman
    Cohen
    Connolly
    Conyers
    Courtney
    Cramer
    Crowley
    Cummings
    Daines
    Davis, Danny
    Davis, Rodney
    DeFazio
    DeGette
    DeLauro
    DelBene
    DeSantis
    DesJarlais
    Deutch
    Dingell
    Doggett
    Doyle
    Duffy
    Duncan (SC)
    Duncan (TN)
    Edwards
    Ellison
    Eshoo
    Farenthold
    Farr
    Fattah
    Fincher
    Fitzpatrick
    Fleischmann
    Fleming
    Fudge
    Gabbard
    Garamendi
    Gardner
    Garrett
    Gibson
    Gohmert
    Gosar
    Gowdy
    Graves (GA)
    Grayson
    Green, Gene
    Griffin (AR)
    Griffith (VA)
    Grijalva
    Hahn
    Hall
    Harris
    Hastings (FL)
    Holt
    Honda
    Huelskamp
    Huffman
    Huizenga (MI)
    Hultgren
    Jeffries
    Jenkins
    Johnson (OH)
    Jones
    Jordan
    Keating
    Kildee
    Kingston
    Labrador
    LaMalfa
    Lamborn
    Larson (CT)
    Lee (CA)
    Lewis
    Loebsack
    Lofgren
    Lowenthal
    Lujan Grisham (NM)
    Luján, Ben Ray (NM)
    Lummis
    Lynch
    Maffei
    Maloney, Carolyn
    Marchant
    Massie
    Matsui
    McClintock
    McCollum
    McDermott
    McGovern
    McHenry
    McMorris Rodgers
    Meadows
    Mica
    Michaud
    Miller, Gary
    Miller, George
    Moore
    Moran
    Mullin
    Mulvaney
    Nadler
    Napolitano
    Neal
    Nolan
    Nugent
    O’Rourke
    Owens
    Pascrell
    Pastor (AZ)
    Pearce
    Perlmutter
    Perry
    Petri
    Pingree (ME)
    Pocan
    Poe (TX)
    Polis
    Posey
    Price (GA)
    Radel
    Rahall
    Rangel
    Ribble
    Rice (SC)
    Richmond
    Roe (TN)
    Rohrabacher
    Ross
    Rothfus
    Roybal-Allard
    Rush
    Salmon
    Sánchez, Linda T.
    Sanchez, Loretta
    Sanford
    Sarbanes
    Scalise
    Schiff
    Schrader
    Schweikert
    Scott (VA)
    Sensenbrenner
    Serrano
    Shea-Porter
    Sherman
    Smith (MO)
    Smith (NJ)
    Southerland
    Speier
    Stewart
    Stockman
    Swalwell (CA)
    Takano
    Thompson (MS)
    Thompson (PA)
    Tierney
    Tipton

    Tonko
    Tsongas
    Vela
    Velázquez
    Walz
    Waters
    Watt
    Waxman
    Weber (TX)
    Welch
    Williams
    Wilson (SC)
    Yarmuth
    Yoder
    Yoho
    Young (AK)

    —- NOES 217 —

    Aderholt
    Alexander
    Andrews
    Bachmann
    Barber
    Barr
    Barrow (GA)
    Benishek
    Bera (CA)
    Bilirakis
    Bishop (GA)
    Bishop (NY)
    Boehner
    Bonner
    Boustany
    Brady (TX)
    Brooks (AL)
    Brooks (IN)
    Brown (FL)
    Brownley (CA)
    Bucshon
    Butterfield
    Calvert
    Camp
    Cantor
    Capito
    Carney
    Carter
    Castor (FL)
    Castro (TX)
    Cole
    Collins (GA)
    Collins (NY)
    Conaway
    Cook
    Cooper
    Costa
    Cotton
    Crawford
    Crenshaw
    Cuellar
    Culberson
    Davis (CA)
    Delaney
    Denham
    Dent
    Diaz-Balart
    Duckworth
    Ellmers
    Engel
    Enyart
    Esty
    Flores
    Forbes
    Fortenberry
    Foster
    Foxx
    Frankel (FL)
    Franks (AZ)
    Frelinghuysen
    Gallego
    Garcia
    Gerlach
    Gibbs
    Gingrey (GA)
    Goodlatte
    Granger
    Graves (MO)
    Green, Al
    Grimm
    Guthrie
    Gutiérrez
    Hanabusa
    Hanna
    Harper
    Hartzler
    Hastings (WA)
    Heck (NV)
    Heck (WA)
    Hensarling
    Higgins
    Himes
    Hinojosa
    Holding
    Hoyer
    Hudson
    Hunter
    Hurt
    Israel
    Issa
    Jackson Lee
    Johnson (GA)
    Johnson, E. B.
    Johnson, Sam
    Joyce
    Kaptur
    Kelly (IL)
    Kelly (PA)
    Kennedy
    Kilmer
    Kind
    King (IA)
    King (NY)
    Kinzinger (IL)
    Kirkpatrick
    Kline
    Kuster
    Lance
    Langevin
    Lankford
    Larsen (WA)
    Latham
    Latta
    Levin
    Lipinski
    LoBiondo
    Long
    Lowey
    Lucas
    Luetkemeyer
    Maloney, Sean
    Marino
    Matheson
    McCarthy (CA)
    McCaul
    McIntyre
    McKeon
    McKinley
    McNerney
    Meehan
    Meeks
    Meng
    Messer
    Miller (FL)
    Miller (MI)
    Murphy (FL)
    Murphy (PA)
    Neugebauer
    Noem
    Nunes
    Nunnelee
    Olson
    Palazzo
    Paulsen
    Payne
    Pelosi
    Peters (CA)
    Peters (MI)
    Peterson
    Pittenger
    Pitts
    Pompeo
    Price (NC)
    Quigley
    Reed
    Reichert
    Renacci
    Rigell
    Roby
    Rogers (AL)
    Rogers (KY)
    Rogers (MI)
    Rooney
    Ros-Lehtinen
    Roskam
    Royce
    Ruiz
    Runyan
    Ruppersberger
    Ryan (OH)
    Ryan (WI)
    Schakowsky
    Schneider
    Schwartz
    Scott, Austin
    Scott, David
    Sessions
    Sewell (AL)
    Shimkus
    Shuster
    Simpson
    Sinema
    Sires
    Slaughter
    Smith (NE)
    Smith (TX)
    Smith (WA)
    Stivers
    Stutzman
    Terry
    Thompson (CA)
    Thornberry
    Tiberi
    Titus
    Turner
    Upton
    Valadao
    Van Hollen
    Vargas
    Veasey
    Visclosky
    Wagner
    Walberg
    Walden
    Walorski
    Wasserman Schultz
    Webster (FL)
    Wenstrup
    Westmoreland
    Whitfield
    Wilson (FL)
    Wittman
    Wolf
    Womack
    Woodall
    Young (FL)
    Young (IN)

    —- NOT VOTING 12 —

    Barletta
    Beatty
    Bustos
    Campbell
    Coble
    Herrera Beutler
    Horsford
    McCarthy (NY)
    Negrete McLeod
    Pallone
    Rokita
    Schock

     
     

    • Ray in VT

      I was happy to see that my Representative voted for the amendment.  Hopefully, even in failure, this will create some movement on the issue.

    • Mike_Card

      Have you sought treatment?  If not, you should.

  • Wm_James_from_Missouri

    Peter Piper picked a peck of pickled peppered pea-peas and sent them to Weiner. Weiner then forwarded them to all the girls he could find.

  • Wm_James_from_Missouri

    Are Weiner’s “pea peas” covered under the Farm Bill?

    • disqus_fw2Bu1dEsd

      Don’t know, but I am a supporter of firm wiener. I mean ….

  • Steve__T

    The dysfunctional “House of Nuts” narrowly rejected a proposal to block the National Security Agency’s bulk collection of data on all phone calls placed in the United States. The amendment to the annual Pentagon funding bill
    would have kept NSA phone spying to specific targets instead of the mass dragnets currently in place. The measure brought together a broad group of Republicans and progressive Democrats for the first major showdown on government spying since Edward Snowden’s leaks were disclosed last month. The final vote was 217 to 205, closer than expected. On the eve of the vote, the Obama administration deployed a lobbying effort to reject the bill, sending NSA director Keith Alexander to meet with lawmakers. (That should have got it passed). In a separate vote, the “Nut House” got it WRONG again and rejected a measure that would have blocked funding for perpetual war under the 2001 act authorizing the so-called war on terror. We can’t have peace if we are in perpetual war, the insanity continues.

  • Ed75

    Pope Francis in Brazil this week with 2.5-3 million young people, two large events today and tomorrow. He isn’t the pope of the poor only (as the media reports), he’s the pope of the whole world, of everyone. He brings Christ to people, and people to Christ.

    The media keeps saying that the Church is losing people to the Pentecostalists. On the one hand they are our brothers and sisters in Christ since they are baptized. On the other hand, who in their right mind would leave the Sacraments of the Church, which are life itself?

    • Wm_James_from_Missouri

      The Pope spent 60 million dollars on his trip to Brazil. Obama spent 100 million dollars on his trip to Africa. People die everyday from the effects of extreme poverty. Our new spy center will cost 2 billion dollars. The 2 wars have already cost us over 2 Trillion dollars. Ed, don’t fool yourself. This is not the message of Christ.

      • Ed75

        About the pope’s trip, it did cost money. But the three million young people, many from other countries, spent much more than that in Rio, though that’s a minor point. I didn’t see that many pilgrims on President Obama’s trip.

    • Ray in VT

      Lot’s of people in their right mind leave the Church.  I left because I didn’t believe.  One of my co-workers left to become some sort of evangelical.  To many people the Church isn’t all that it is cracked up to be.

      • Ed75

        The Church is the ordinary means that God has established to bring life and forgiveness of sins and salvation to mankind, to administer the grace won by Christ and his saints to the world.

        Can fullness of life in this world and eternal life with God in the next be over-rated?

        • Ray in VT

          Yes.  Plenty of people live full and rewarding lives with other faiths or no faith at all, and seeing as how I have yet to see any evidence of any sort of life hereafter, I think that it is all a bunch of hype.

          • Ed75

            That’s fair enough, just keep open to the idea. Sometimes people say the prayer ‘If you are there, show yourself to me’. (The Gospels give a picture of someone raised from the dead, but I can understand you’re not accepting that yet.)

    • J__o__h__n

      Lots of us left after realizing it is just myths and an utterly corrupt institution. 

    • Mike_Card

      You are totally screwed up; have you sought treatment?  Or are you one of those who refuse to acknowledge his/her affliction?

  • Ray in VT

    Louise Brown, the world’s first test tube baby, just turned 35:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-23448665

    If I recall correctly there was, and still is, opposition to the procedure from the Church, and wasn’t there some sort of debate as to whether or not she would have a soul?

    • sickofthechit

       I thought the lack of soul was about priests who sexually abused children.

  • Wm_James_from_Missouri

    Some happy news.

    “In a first operating room test, the iKnife diagnosed tissue samples from 91 patients with 100 percent accuracy, instantly providing information that normally requires laboratory tests that can take up to a half hour, “

    http://www.lef.org/news/LefDailyNews.htm?NewsID=19638&Section=DISEASE&utm_source=DailyHealthBulletin&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Disease&utm_content=Body+ContinueReading&utm_campaign=DHB_130719

  • Ray in VT

    Will there be any discussion of the upsurge in violence in Iraq?  There were the prison attacks, and there have been continued shootings and bombings, such as those reported here yesterday:

    http://www.boston.com/news/world/middle-east/2013/07/25/police-militants-ambush-truck-convoy-kill/7nxwvx1FKwvP4yFwCz74nJ/story.html

    There have been nearly 2,500 killed since the beginning of May according to some sources.

  • sickofthechit

    I can’t believe Weiner’s wife was willing to stand  by him during this latest fiasco.  Surely the voter’s of New York are more discerning….?  charles A. Bowsher

  • sickofthechit

    Weiner, he’s an idiot; his wife is beautiful.

    • Ray in VT

      and quite intelligent by all accounts (perhaps her choice in men aside).  She’s put up with quite a bit these past couple of years.

      • HonestDebate1

        I don’t know what kind of kooky marriage they have, it’s none of my business. But it seems to me she is too intelligent. She appears to be unemotionally calculating the upside of political success with the downside of public humiliation. 

        Again, not my business but I say bravo to Jenny Sanford for not standing by the sleazball’s side and getting shame all over her. It’s such a better message to young feminist.

        • Ray in VT

          They may have a perfectly normal marriage, albeit one in which one partner is having to deal with the reprehensible actions of the other partner.  I’m not going to speculate about any potential motives that she may have.  My working assumption, unless information emerges to the contrary, is that she loves the dolt enough to try to work through the issues that he has.

          • HonestDebate1

            I feel the same way and as far as we know there was no physical contact which takes the offense down a notch. 

            But I do think the message to she sends young women is horrible.

          • J__o__h__n

            As far as sexual lapses go, this was very minor, but what kind of an idiot keeps doing it after a public apology and then runs for office knowing there is more out there?  A picture is worth a thousand Twitter characters.   

          • HonestDebate1

            I agree within the context of their marriage. People are in to and put up with weird stuff. 

            But in the context of a sleaze ball running for mayor it’s kind of sick. This last set of tweets appears to be consensual but previously he sent happy Wiener  pictures  unsolicited to unsuspecting women. That is the act of a sexual predator and criminal.

          • J__o__h__n

            I thought he didn’t intend to send it to more than one and was too stupid to reply individually. 

          • Ray in VT

            I agree with the former, but not the latter, statement.  People can spin this one any way that they want.  One could just as easily view her as a loving, forgiving woman courageously fighting to keep her family together.

          • HonestDebate1

            I suppose but I’ve seen too many failed attempts to do that. In the end, it makes things worse. It tells young boys there is no consequence for treating women as sexual objects and it tells young women to tolerate unacceptable behavior. 

          • Ray in VT

            I’ve seen plenty of marriages survive worse transgressions and go on to be healthy and productive, and I do not agree with either of your latter sentiments, as people will take things as they will, that is with great variability depending upon the person.

        • Don_B1

          If it is not your business, why are you making it your business?

          More of the Mark Anthony speech method which is the basis of push-polling?

        • Mike_Card

          Agree there.  Weiner is just too weird for words; makes one wonder about who his opponent was, or who his supporters are.

    • creaker

      Considering his wife is still with him she gets a nomination for idiot as well.

  • Duras

    In North Carolina, republicans are pushing a bill that would require voter id, curtail early voting, and raise the cap on campaign donations. 

    Republicans are blatantly anti-democracy.  

    Just so people know, I had to renew my driver’s license before the 2012 election.  I needed two forms of id for the renewal.  I had to spend $60 to order a birth certificate from Ohio and another $60 for the actual pictured driver’s license.  That’s a $120 to vote in the state of Florida for politicians who almost invariably represent their biggest donors. 

     

    • Ray in VT

      Plus it ends same day voting, requiring people to register 25 days before the election and it ends “a popular high school civics program that registers tens of thousands of
      students to vote each year in advance of their 18th birthdays”.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/25/north-carolina-voter-id-bill_n_3656084.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

    • HonestDebate1

      Now if we could just get rid of early voting.

      • Ray in VT

        Well, someone’s got to carry the torch for that noble cause of seeking to ensure that fewer people vote.

        http://elections.gmu.edu/early_vote_2012.html

        Nothing like inconveniencing some 2.7 million voters.

        • HonestDebate1

          I agree, voting is a sacred duty not a convenience. 

          • Ray in VT

            So, therefore, we should make it harder for people? I guess that that is one way to win elections, by discouraging people from turning out.  Maybe we could reduce the number of polling stations and voting machines so that only the dedicated people will wait around in order to exercise their rights.

          • HonestDebate1

            That’s weird, I disagree. We should have more polling stations and voting booths not  less. 

          • Ray in VT

            Just only on one day, so that if you’re sick, or you have to work all day, or if your car breaks down, then that’s just tough luck for you?

          • HonestDebate1

            Exactly, although I’m open to making it s national holiday.

          • Ray in VT

            Well, there is yet another horrible idea (the former statement.  I would support the latter), with about the right level of basic compassion and understanding that I have come to expect from you.

            While we’re at it, I am opposed to this newfangled secret ballot.  If openly declaring one’s vote by voice was good enough 200 years ago, then it is good enough today.

          • Duras

            What republican has proposed that before the 2012 election or in North Carolina recently?

          • nj_v2

            “sacred duty”

            DisHonestMisDebatorGreggg tries to sound profound, ends up sounding like fool.

          • HonestDebate1

            Okay, it’s a willy-nilly knee-jerk thing deserving no reflection or reverence. Alrighty then.

    • hennorama

      Just another sort of poll tax.  Sad.

    • William

       I only paid 21.50 to get my birth certificate from Ohio.

      https://odhgateway.odh.ohio.gov/OrderBirthCertificates/

      • Duras

        B. S., I paid $60 in 2012 to have it sent out of state.  Obviously, the prices have changed, but what doesn’t change is the fact that people should not have to pay a single penny to vote. 

        If IDs were free and within close proximity to all citizens, there would be no argument.  The fact is that these laws are a conscious attempt to prevent certain people from voting and you know it. 

        • William

           It pays to shop around.

    • OnPointComments

      It’s peculiar that almost all people who are very, very worried that someone’s right to vote will be infringed if they have to show an ID aren’t at all worried that their second amendment rights will be infringed if they have to provide an ID and have a background check.

      • Don_B1

        Every, repeat EVERY, citizen of the U.S. has the right to vote, though some have been proscribed as/while felons. Registration to vote is sufficient to determine proper lists and no significant violations have been found in people voting when not on the list.

        Even Justice Scalia agrees that certain citizens, as determined by legislatures and courts, do NOT, repeat DO NOT, have the right to own a gun. Therefore it is necessary to do the checking to determine which citizens have “Second Amendment” rights to purchase a gun. Significant numbers of gun purchasers ARE prohibited from making those purchases.

        • OnPointComments

          Welfare fraud. Medicare fraud. Bank fraud. Identity theft. Telemarketing fraud. Insurance fraud. Credit card fraud. Cyber fraud. Investment fraud. Immigration fraud. Tax fraud.

          Liberals assure us that voter fraud doesn’t exist. Why don’t I believe them?

          • Duras

            Did you ever look at the difference between Obama’s cuts to medicare and Paul Ryan’s cuts to medicare?

            Obama’s cut targeted the massive medicare fraud which is exclusively on the supplier side, while Ryan cut exclusively from the consumer side and doesn’t touch a dime of fraud.  Which was Ryan’s purpose, because it would have caused medicare to collapse. 

            You know, as I’m reading your comment, I don’t think you know what liberalism is.  “Bank fraud” Really?  Gee, if liberals are for any thing, it is letting the moneychangers do whatever they want….

            You’re just stupid. 

          • OnPointComments

            This might help you understand the comment that I posted: http://www.readingrockets.org/helping/questions/comprehension/

          • Duras

            Okay, fine.  Good one.

            Just for the record, there were roughly 40 cases of voter fraud during from the first Bush election to the first Obama election; there were 26 convictions.  26 bad votes is good cause to disenfranchise thousands of voters.  It is a republican smoke screen.  

      • Duras

        The words “well regulated” are in the second amendment.  As far as I can tell, republicans are breaking the second amendment by not regulating arms well.

  • John Cedar

    The Washington post is interested in Weiner’s psychological  issues. They should be more interested in the psychological issues of his wife and the people that vote for him.

  • John Cedar

    Did Obama give a speech on the economy without blaming Bush?

    How long did it take Obama and his super majority senate and majority lower house to reverse those Bush Tax cuts?
    He never reversed them while he had both houses and they only got rolled back some after his second term.

    • northeaster17

      By the end of Bush’s 2nd term we were in the grips of the largest economic crisis since the Great Depression.
      The question here is what’s the next largest crisis since the depression?
      I’m fairly sure that it is the Savings and Loan Crisis that came to light at the end of Father Bush’s term. What is it with these guys? 
      And to think that Jeb might get a shot at the White House also.

    • NewtonWhale

      After 5 years under Obama as compared to 8 years under Bush we have created MORE jobs and are shrinking the deficit faster than at any time since WWII.

      “Over President Bush’s tenure, the private sector lost a net 665,000 jobs.”
       http://reflectionsofarationalrepublican.com/2013/02/03/bush-vs-obama-unemployment-january-2013-jobs-data/

       “Obama has been a net job creator. The economy has 2.3 million more jobs than it did.” 

      http://economy.money.cnn.com/2013/07/24/obamas-jobs-record-where-are-we-now/

      • HonestDebate1

        That’s funny!

      • Don_B1

        President Obama would have created even more jobs, jobs necessary to create a strongly growing economy, without the total obstruction of the Tea/Republican Party.

      • John Cedar

        All of the yearly Bush deficits were measured in a few hundred billion and all of the yearly Obama deficits are measured in the same…plus a trillion. Why would you post that gobbledygook deficit percentage crap?

        Bush’s highest deficit was after the GOP lost both houses. Bushes next highest deficit was his first year when he was rebounding from the Clinton dot-com-bubble global crossing, Sprint, Enron, recession. That and 9/11 crippled the economy too, which we all know wouldn’t have happened if Clinton had responded appropriately the first time the trade centers werer attacked.

        • NewtonWhale

          The fact that you cannot source your assertions speaks for itself.

          Read the charts:

          Economic Downturn and Legacy of Bush Policies Continue to Drive Large Deficits 

          Just two policies dating from the Bush Administration — tax cuts and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan — accounted for over $500 billion of the deficit in 2009 and will account for nearly $6 trillion in deficits in 2009 through 2019 (including associated debt-service costs of $1.4 trillion).  By 2019, we estimate that these two policies will account for almost half— over $8 trillion — of the $17 trillion in debt that will be owed under current policies.[7]   (See Figure 2.)  These impacts easily dwarf the stimulus and financial rescues, which will account for less than $2 trillion (just over 10 percent) of the debt at that time.  Furthermore, unlike those temporary costs, these inherited policies do not fade away as the economy recovers.[8]

          http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3849

    • MrNutso

      The “temporary” tax cuts were set to expire anyway.  If they were to be “temporary” when the were enacted by Republicans wide did Republicans fight so hard to keep them?

  • http://www.CayerComputing.com/ Melissa A. Cayer

    The Cicadas are loud around here (ArlHts,IL). How are the Cicadas in your area?

    • MrNutso

      I don’t think I have heard any in SEPA

  • HonestDebate1

    Huma’s years at Hillary’s side have served her well. Laying down to be an elegant doormat is not an easy choice. 

  • alsordi

    Hey how about your country the USA, pulling off a coup in Egypt, imprisoning an elected president, and then continuing to sell them arms.  And they ask ” why do they hate America?”

    Then they refuse to call it a coup and instigate Egypt into civil war.  Sound familiar?   Another MISSION ACCOMPLISHED in the Middle East..   Until Sunnis and Shiites, and moderate and conservative muslims, finally figure out the strategy.Whether it be Mubarak, Hussein, Ghadafi or Barack Obama,  they are just figure heads to take the blame and to be thrown under the bus.   The international bankers  have their agenda and continue their ruthless chess game. 

    • J__o__h__n

      Egypt has nothing the moneyed elites would want other than trying to keep that region stable.  Why would they want to back two successive regime changes? 

      • alsordi

        are you that naive ?

  • J__o__h__n

    Is anyone else disappointed that William and Kate didn’t name the baby Carlos Danger? 

    • Ray in VT

      My boss was hoping for Ethelred.

    • jefe68

      I was hoping for Baldrick. Or Edmond, as in Edmund Blackadder.

      Or Sydney Leathers.

      • Ray in VT

        I hear that Baldrick has a cunning plan.

  • alsordi

    As if the USA hasn’t already totally lost is moral standing in the M.E., after ravaging and alienating the entire Muslim world… then comes along Huma, the Hillary protege, and her Weiner husband. 

  • HonestDebate1

    Is there any union left that still supports Obamacare?

  • Ray in VT

    Apparently in addition to opposing the legality of various “unnatural” sex acts between consenting adults, gubernatorial candidate Ken Cuccinelli has also supported the criminal punishment of adultery:

    http://politicalwire.com/archives/2013/07/24/cuccinelli_backed_anti-adultery_laws.html

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      “Jobs are Job N+1″ with some parties.

      • Don_B1

        Unfortunately for the country the list of parties does NOT, repeat NOT, include the Republican Party, unless you restrict it to Republican jobs.

  • toc1234

    Lord…  Obama talking about the economy is like a 5 y/o talking about football…  but at least the 5 y/o doesn’t rely on tired clichés and hackneyed metaphors.. 

  • toc1234

    Obama on Jobs – really, this time he means it… yeah, right:

    reporter Mary Bruce thoroughly documents the president’s perseveration:

    February 2009: The president tells Congress “now is the time to jumpstart job creation” and his agenda “begins with jobs.”

    November 2009: Meeting with his Economic Recovery Advisory Board, the president says his administration “will not rest until we are succeeding in generating the jobs that this economy needs.”

    April 2010: Obama goes on a “Main Street” tour, saying “it’s time to rebuild our economy on a new foundation so that we’ve got real and sustained growth.”

    June 2010: The president declares a “Recovery Summer” to highlight the jobs created by stimulus-funded infrastructure projects. “If we want to ensure that Americans can compete with any nation in the world, we’re going to have to get serious about our long-term vision for this country and we’re going to have to get serious about our infrastructure,” he said.

    December 2010: The president tells reporters “we are past the crisis point in the economy, but we now have to pivot and focus on jobs and growth.”

    August 2011: After lawmakers reach a compromise to avert default, the president vows “in the coming months, I’ll continue also to fight for what the American people care most about: new jobs, higher wages and faster economic growth.”

    February 2013: At the start of his second term, the president refocuses on job creation in his State of the Union address, saying “a growing economy that creates good, middle-class jobs–that must be the North Star that guides our efforts.”

    May 2013: Kicking off his “Jobs and Opportunity Tour,” the president says “all of us have to commit ourselves to doing better than we’re doing now. And all of us have to rally around the single-greatest challenge that we face as a country right now, and that’s reigniting the true engine of economic growth, a rising, thriving middle class.”

    July 2013: and finally on Wednesday, President Obama spoke at University of Central Missouri about education and the economy.

    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…….

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      President Obama has realized it’s him v. the intransigent Republican nutjobs.

      But the deeper problem is the Republican opposition to negotiating the differences at all. Boehner insisted yesterday he would not lift the debt ceiling, a move he has previously conceded is absolutely necessary, unless Obama agrees to additional spending cuts, though Boehner has not even specified the cuts he has in mind. Meanwhile, the GOP is increasingly rallying around the threat of a government shutdown as a last-ditch stand to prevent the implementation of health care reform.

      So, John (Bad at his job) Boehner goes back on his word again.

      The feces-flingers on the right don’t want the government to pay bills already incurred.

      And the whiny-ass ttty-babies make noises about throwing another tantrum, threatening to shut down government again, to keep from enacting a law.

      The right-wing are not normal people who have gone to DC to govern. This ain’t my daddy’s GOP.

      • Don_B1

        You have nailed the basic issues of Republican opposition, where the root of the current threats is delineated here:

        http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/26/opinion/krugman-republican-health-care-panic.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

        One last hurrah from the Republicans. In some ways, since it will take the equivalent of the government shutdown against Clinton to take the starch out of the Tea/Republicans, or at least out of the support for them, the sooner the better, as long as President Obama is ready to stand up to them this time and let it all hang out.

        I could see a month-long shutdown with this crew now calling the tune, unless Speaker Boehner is willing to lose his office. But the sooner it happens the less damage it will cause and the sooner the country can move to implement corrective action and get strong economic growth going. Letting this obstruction continue is really bad for the future of this country.

        A long government shutdown just might get the big business interests to stop backing ANY Republican until the Tea/Republican/libertarians are defrocked.

    • StilllHere

      Watch Obama apologist start whining about how they don’t like democracy.

  • Coastghost

    “Steady persistent effort on economic growth sought by President, details to come”. Has our President not received the memo that multi-tasking is dead?

  • DrewInGeorgia

    Yes, PLEASE get the Royal Baby Weiner hoo-hah out of the way.

    LNG, SAC, and Halliburton…Oh my.
    Oh, and train derailments, please discuss those too.
    Thanks.

  • nj_v2

    Hahaha!

    Oilybomber speachifying about the “forces that have conspired against the middle class.”

    Wait, how many of the bankster/Wall Street thugs who ruined the lives of thousands of people have been prosecuted under his administration?

    Whose administration is negotiating new, job-destroying “free-trade” agreements?

    Who bailed out on the public option for health care?

    I can’t stand the sound of his voice any more.

  • nj_v2

    *Ding*

    Time’s up for flogging the Weiner.

    Move on…

  • Dave Bevis

    Regardless of what you think about the content of what he did, how can anyone support this guy that one, cannot control whatever drives this behavior and two, is stupid enough to think he can get away with it.

    • StilllHere

      You’re talking about Barack, right?

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

    What did Mark Sanford’s wife say about l’affaire Weiner?

    Or did Sanford rehab himself out of the media’s memory?

    Because when it comes to poorly-behaved polticians, Dems disgracing themselves quite readily.

    But the Dems don’t come back to regulating what I do in my bedroom, or inserting themselves between women and their doctors.

    • gekkobear

       “But the Dems don’t come back to regulating what I do in my bedroom,”

      Right, liek Spitzer. Sure he frequented prostitutes; but he … also prosecuted a lot of men in NY for frequenting prostitutes as DA.

      So that’s ok.  See it’s ok when he does it and jail time for you when you do it.  He’s a liberal elite; they don’t have to follow laws.

      Who has been regulating what you do in your bedroom anyhow? Are you claiming they’re banning something you do? You murdering people in there? 

      And women and their doctors are fine until a fetus hits viability. Why can’t they manage to do something before 20 weeks have passed?  Does it take 16+ weeks to see a doctor where you are?

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

        You’ve already shown complete willingness to ignore the hoops that the GOP makes women go through for a legal medical procedure. A big part of that obstacle course is creating bullflop expenses and troubles that make it impossible to do without taking time off from work, say.

        No problem for a daughter of privilege, like a Meagan McCain, who (should she want an abortion) can always take a jet to a civilized country for a safe procedure.

        So, I invite you to keep digging your hole. Keep trying to defend right-wing TRAP laws on anything but “I don’t trust a woman to do something and I need to let the government insert itself there”.

  • toc1234

    Mr Obama – you forgot to mention lower corporate taxes abroad..

  • nj_v2

    Plenty of Rethuglicon support for Obama when he’s being regressively autocratic…

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jul/25/democratic-establishment-nsa

    Democratic establishment unmasked: prime defenders of NSA bulk spying
    NYT: “The Obama administration made common cause with the House Republican leadership”

    One of the worst myths Democratic partisans love to tell themselves – and everyone else – is that the GOP refuses to support President Obama no matter what he does. Like its close cousin – the massively deceitful inside-DC grievance that the two parties refuse to cooperate on anything – it’s hard to overstate how false this Democratic myth is. When it comes to foreign policy, war, assassinations, drones, surveillance, secrecy, and civil liberties, President Obama’s most stalwart, enthusiastic defenders are often found among the most radical precincts of the Republican Party.

    The rabidly pro-war and anti-Muslim GOP former Chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee, Peter King, has repeatedly lavished Obama with all sorts of praise and support for his policies in those areas. The Obama White House frequently needs, and receives, large amounts of GOP Congressional support to have its measures enacted or bills its dislikes defeated.…

    (snipped)

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      “If this is anyone but Steve Allen, you’re stealing my bit!”

      (h/t Krusty the Clown)

  • http://www.facebook.com/anita.paul.5680 Anita Paul

    Hello what he is saying the congress is spending their time repealing ACA 39 times, fake scandals and abortion.  They have not offered one item related to jobs. 

    • MrNutso

      Because they think getting rid of ACA and handcuffing the President with scandals will create jobs.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

        I don’t know if the right actually believe getting rid of the ACA will do create jobs. They want newsreaders to say that, however.

        I would submit that the same way the right wishes to destroy SocSec by “reforming” it, they want to stop ACA before it becomes another political and policy success brought to you by Democrats.

        The GOP’s political fortunes can’t afford to have another Social Security (FDR) or Medicare (LBJ).

        Per Paul Krugman, “Better-informed people on the right seem, finally, to be facing up to a horrible truth: Health care reform, President Obama’s signature policy achievement, is probably going to work.”If it’s going to work, the right wants to destroy it. Now.

        • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

          has the cost/quality of your healthcare program gone up or down?

      • StilllHere

        The president created his own scandals; IRS, NSA, AP, Benghazi and he’s delaying ACA another year which probably won’t be the last time.

    • nlpnt

      I wonder how much it costs the taxpayers to hold a vote in Congress?

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

        Interesting idea, but on the trail of “penny wise, pound foolish”, we could save lots of money by  letting Americans for Prosperity or the Kochs and ALEC write all our laws, not just in some State Houses.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

    The evitable happened.

    Thanks, Deadeye Diick. You “learned em well”.

  • Casey Reyner

    Why is it whenever a democrat does something sexual, has an affair, uses a prostitute, tweets his Weiner, the are immediately called to withdraw or resign? But when a republican does the same, while championing family values (i.e. Vitter, among others) they apologize, but no one ever thinks they need to quite their job.  What’s more Anthony Weiner to my understanding has never actually touched another person. and has broken no laws.

  • http://www.facebook.com/anita.paul.5680 Anita Paul

    No one wants a grand bargain. The deficit has been already been cut by 2.6 Trillion dollars. 

    • Markus6

      This makes it sound as if it’s no longer a problem. Plus, I doubt this is accurate and the official government numbers back this up (it’s not even close to a Trillion). 

      In any event, there’s still a yearly deficit of over half a trillion. And that means that the overall national debt is still increasing and is almost 17 Trillion. You’re not saying this is unimportant, but I am astounded that some people don’t understand the difference between yearly deficit and total national debt and don’t think 17 Trillion in debt doesn’t matter all that much. 

      • hennorama

        Markus6 – this is (mostly) accurate and the official government numbers back this up.

        Well, the number is actually ($2.5016 Trillion) in Current Dollars, and ($2.5477 Trillion) in Constant 2005 Dollars.

        These figures are the cumulative total Federal deficit reductions, comparing the peak FY 2009 deficit level to the annual deficit figures, through the estimate for FY 2015.

        See:
        http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/budget/fy2014/assets/hist01z3.xls

        (Table 1.3—SUMMARY OF RECEIPTS, OUTLAYS, AND SURPLUSES OR DEFICITS (–) IN CURRENT DOLLARS, CONSTANT (FY 2005) DOLLARS, AND AS PERCENTAGES OF GDP: 1940–2018)

        • Markus6

          Our sources disagree, but that’s not the point. I think we’d agree that there still is a yearly deficit, it is shrinking, but therefore the national debt is still increasing and around 17 T. And I hope we agree that a 17 Trillion debt is a massive problem. 

          My quibble was with people who confuse the debt with the deficit and don’t think 17 Trillion is of great importance. They amaze me. 

          • hennorama

            Markus6 – TY for your response.

            “Our sources disagree”? What source(s) are you using?

            Certainly the deficit and the overall debt are important issues.

            The annual Federal deficits in constant 2005 dollars have been reduced every year since FY 2009, which began Oct. 1, 2008 during the worst of the Great Recession, and prior to the current administration.

            The overall Federal debt is large, but is not “a massive problem”

            The United States has had budget deficits for about 80% of its history. Since 1940, there have been budget surpluses for only 14 of 72 years, making those 58 deficit years merely a continuation of the norm (58/72 = 80.6%).

            The US has also been in debt for nearly its entire existence, as pointed out by another poster through this article by L. Randall Wray, written in 2010:

            http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2010/02/wray-the-federal-budget-is-not-like-a-household-budget-%E2%80%93-here%E2%80%99s-why.html

            What happens when these deficit and debt trends are significantly changed? There is a discussion of this in the same article. Quoting in part and edited for brevity:

            “The United States has also experienced six periods of depression. The depressions began in 1819, 1837, 1857, 1873, 1893, and 1929 … With the exception of the Clinton surpluses, every significant reduction of the outstanding debt has been followed by a depression, and every depression has been preceded by significant debt reduction. The Clinton surplus was followed by the Bush recession, a speculative euphoria, and then the collapse in which we now find ourselves … While we cannot rule out coincidences, seven surpluses followed by six and a half depressions (with some possibility for making it the perfect seven) should raise some eyebrows. And, by the way, our less serious downturns have almost always been preceded by reductions of federal budget deficits.”

            While I make no claims as to causality vs. coincidence, this should at least raise some eyebrows, as the author said.

            Be careful what you wish for.

            By the way, the Federal Budget might be balanced with one simple idea – Impose a $100/round tax on ammunition.

            Roughly 10 billion rounds are sold annually in the US, and the deficit was recently around $1 Trillion.

            Firearms-Firing Patriots – Do Your Part! Be Fiscally Responsible And Balance The Federal Budget!

            As Pres. Clinton said “It’s arithmetic.”

            Thanks again for your response.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      There are plenty of Democrats left of the President, and it’s sorta telling that NPR is not very interested in giving left-of-Obama ideas (a.k.a. “the Grand Bargain is neither”) any weight unless everyone else inside the Beltway does.

      And that simply doesn’t happen. It’s “find the average of the WaPo editorial page, Diane Sawyer, Howard Kurtz and Politico”.

    • StilllHere

      Finally some progress, but still a long way to go.

  • nj_v2

    Right-wing watch:

    http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/07/groundswell-rightwing-group-ginni-thomas

    Inside Groundswell: Read the Memos of the New Right-Wing Strategy Group Planning a “30 Front War”
    Ginni Thomas, Allen West, and a crew of conservative activists and journalists have formed a hush-hush coalition to battle progressives—and Karl Rove.

    Believing they are losing the messaging war with progressives, a group of prominent conservatives in Washington—including the wife of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas and journalists from Breitbart News and the Washington Examiner—has been meeting privately since early this year to concoct talking points, coordinate messaging, and hatch plans for “a 30 front war seeking to fundamentally transform the nation,” according to documents obtained by Mother Jones.
     
    Dubbed Groundswell, this coalition convenes weekly in the offices of Judicial Watch, the conservative legal watchdog group. During these hush-hush sessions and through a Google group, the members of Groundswell—including aides to congressional Republicans—cook up battle plans for their ongoing fights against the Obama administration, congressional Democrats, progressive outfits, and the Republican establishment and “clueless” GOP congressional leaders. They devise strategies for killing immigration reform, hyping the Benghazi controversy, and countering the impression that the GOP exploits racism. And the Groundswell gang is mounting a behind-the-scenes organized effort to eradicate the outsize influence of GOP über-strategist/pundit Karl Rove within Republican and conservative ranks.…

    (snipped)

    • hennorama

      Anthony Weiner just announced that he’s forming a coalition to oppose Groundswell:

      Groinswell.

      No word yet as to the ‘membership’ requirements.

  • toc1234

    maybe explore how rich it is for Sen Warren to complain about levels of student debt when Prof Warren made 350k her last yr at Harvard for teaching one class two nights a wk.  talk about profiting off backs of students. 

    • StilllHere

      Exactly, better for the president to create strawmen.

    • northeaster17

      That may be true but the real point is that it should not take away from her work to reduce the preditory interest rates that are forced on students.

  • hennorama

    The following is intended as satire.

    Why in the world is On Point putting Anthony Weiner above President Obama? Are we really going to compare someone ‘sexting’ over the last 30 months with an elected official speaking on education and the economy?

    Bizarre.

    And what’s the deal with the train crash video above the President’s image? Is On Point comparing the President and a train wreck?

    Damn you On Point!

  • William

    Detroit had the “fostering hand of government to help” and failed.

  • HLB

    We can’t have the country and the economy Jack is speaking to as long as there is a snake gripping the world and squeezing the life out of it. That voracious reptile is Goldman Sachs.

    Thanks much. HLB

  • nlpnt

    Caller Jerome: That’s exactly what Obama did in the first term, and he was criticized for not using the bully pulpit enough!

  • MrNutso

    Come on caller.  How do you deal with people who’s only position is to say no to anything you propose.  The people in power you are talking about are school children.  When Republicans put adults in positions of power, then maybe something can be worked out.

    • StilllHere

      Please, what kind of leadership proposes crap created in a vacuum of his own hubris and expects everyone to just follow along like sheep?  Maybe this is what he is used to in his own party, from the media and from sycophants at his community organizations but welcome to the real world.  This guy has no accomplishments from all his years in the Illinois and US Senates, so why are you surprised?

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

        You say “real world” and all I can think of is:

        Most unaccomplished House term. Unprecedented need to not pay the government’s bills.

        Most obstructionist Senate. Record number of new, modern, lazy-ass fake filibusters.

        Keep blaming Obama for the little tantrums the right is throwing. It looks good on you.

        • StilllHere

          I wouldn’t expect you to have any concept of the real world and you don’t disappoint.  If Obama can’t lead and Democrats can’t govern then back to the Community Organizations with ‘em.  And you started the lame blame game, it’s all you’ve got.  Pathetic.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            I got history, you got…whatever that is.

            At least you could pretend to miss the part of Ronald Reagan who got stuff done with the help of Tip O’Neill.

          • StilllHere

            Please, you’ve apparently also got your little man fantasies. 

  • thinkingfirst

    Jack Beatty for President please.

    • toc1234

      Jack Beatty for President of Venezuela please.

  • nj_v2

    Time for a new war. Recons start beating the drum…

    http://www.theglobaldispatch.com/lindsey-graham-says-he-plans-to-introduce-an-authorization-for-the-use-of-military-force-in-iran-by-summers-end-82742/

    Lindsey Graham Says He Plans To Introduce An Authorization For The Use Of Military Force In Iran By Summers End

    Just days after saying the same thing in an interview at the Capital last Tuesday, Sen. Lindsey Graham R-SC)  again said in front of a friendly audience at a conference put on by the Christians United for Israel that he introduce a resolution to authorize war with Iran.

    “If nothing changes in Iran, come September, October, I will present a resolution that will authorize the use of military force to prevent Iran from developing a nuclear bomb,” Graham told the conference audience.

    “The only way to convince Iran to halt their nuclear program is to make it clear that we will take it out,” he continues.

    (snipped)

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      “Start beating the drum” implies that the right stopped since the last “war with Iran is inevitable” chant a few years ago.

      But the rest is spot on.

      • nj_v2

        Point taken.

    • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

      we cant just keep hacking them? oh yeah that would be too cheap and effective

  • Ray in VT
    • hennorama

      That is hilarious!

      When I tried a few, these were the results:

      Tom Ashbrook = Felipe Evil

      Annie Lowery = Felipe Jeopardy

      Major Garrett = Jorge Scourge

      Jack Beatty = Rolando Threat

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

        Did you see the fake Weiner photo?

        Ummm….let me rephrease that: Did you see the face photo of Anthony Weiner which had a little mustache added to it on The Colbert Report?

        It made Weiner look like a maitre’d, another job requiring a dose of haughty self-importance.

        • Ray in VT

          The Daily Show really took it to him, including a trailer for a Carlos Danger movie.

        • WorriedfortheCountry

           Oh, they added the mustache to his face.

          Whew, I was a bit worried there for a minute.

      • jefe68

        HonestDebate = Jaime Peril

        Stillhere = Federico Death

        • hennorama

          jefe68 – I considered how it might play out if those sorts of examples were put in the forum, and rejected that idea, as it would no doubt encourage some one-upsmanship.

          Regardless, the site is hilarious.

          BTW -

          jefe68 = Ernesto Furtive

          hennorama . (that’s a “dot” as Last Name) = Cesar Stealth

          A big Thank You to slate.com, and to Ray in VT for bringing this to our attention.

          • nj_v2

            I wasn’t expecting much, but nj/v2 = Inigo Dynamite

      • J__o__h__n

        Eliot Spitzer = Mario Smash

    • WorriedfortheCountry

       Carlos Danger == “white Hispanic”?

  • nj_v2

    Snowden is wanted for “treason” for making public what most people suspected about illegal government spying.

    Halliburton admits to destroying evidence, gets small fine and three-years “probation.”

    That’ll teach ‘em!

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/26/business/halliburton-pleads-guilty-to-destroying-evidence-after-gulf-spill.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&smid=tw-nytimes&_r=2&

    Halliburton Pleads Guilty to Destroying Evidence After Gulf Spill

    …The Justice Department filed one criminal charge against the company. In a statement, Halliburton said that the violation was a misdemeanor associated with the deletion of records created after the accident. Additionally, the company said, “The Department of Justice has agreed that it will not pursue further criminal prosecution of the company.”…

    (excerpt)

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      (I beat you to that Halliburton link, BTW.)

      • nj_v2

        I noticed that after i posted it.

        Yours lacked the accompanying snarky/sarcasic comment, however.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

          Yeah, but I have the “honor” of being caught in moderation for spelling Cheney’s familiar first name properly. There’s a reason the one you saw says “Diick”.

          • nj_v2

            Call it even, then.

    • alsordi

      Sandy Berger shoves secret documents down his pants to destroy something really bad for his buddies.

  • nlpnt

    The NSA vote seems to have fallen on insider/outsider lines. The outsiders voted yes for the good of the country, the insiders voted no out of fear of what would happen if they didn’t give the NSA the “tools” (read:toys) to do whatever they wanted and something happened.

    • jimino

      I expect another dividing line is between those whose Congressional  districts are seeing huge governmental spending on buildings and contractors who make up this secret security apparatus and those who aren’t.  In my district we have had a profusion of data mining/storing facilities and my Rep. was a “no”.

  • HLB

    Spying on Americans is wrong. It doesn’t matter who does it. Want to search my email or my trash? Walk into a regular U.S. courthouse and get a proper warrant. Not from some political actor pretending to be a judge on a secret court.

    It’s past time to end the Obama secret police state.

    Thanks much. Veteran/Citizen/Old School Liberal

    • nj_v2

      Thank you!

    • northeaster17

      I like the notion that spying on Americans is wrong. However I find it disturbing that citizens all over the world are fair game for whatever sort of techno snooping we come up with. The resentment bred from that sort of activity will not serve us well as time goes on.

  • nj_v2

    Rethuglicon Jack*ss of the Week:

    http://www.commondreams.org/further/2013/07/25-1

    You (Still) Can’t Fix Stupid: Louie Gohmert Compares Minorities to Snail Darters and Various Lizards

    So this happened: During a House Judiciary Committee hearing on a bill that would ban third parties from intervening in regulatory actions aimed at preventing discrimination on the basis of race, sex, national origin, or other protected characteristics, Tea Party idiot and Texas representative Louie ‘Terror Babies’ Gohmert mockingly dismissed Democrats concerns about discrimination by equating protecting the civil rights of minorities with protecting the rights of delta smelt, lesser prairie chicken, greater sage grouse and other insects. Ha, hilarious, Louie. Texas, we feel for you. Your tax dollars at work.

    “There is nobody in this chamber who is more appreciative than I am for the gentleman from Tennessee and my friend from Michigan standing up for the rights of race, religion, national religion of the Delta Smelt, the snail darter, various lizards, the lesser prairie chicken, the greater sage grouse and so many other insects who would want someone standing for their religion, their race, their national origin and I think that’s wonderful.”

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

    Iowa Republican Steve King embarrasses himself and the entire GOP during an interview with Newsmax?

    Wow, I didn’t see that coming!

    Seriously, right-wingers are so used to talking with friendly, non-confrontational media outlets like Newsmax that this kind of thing is a matter of when, not if.

    Sooner or later the inner id comes out when one doesn’t even have to be on their guard the very small amount that an Inbred like David Gregory or Bob Schieffer demands.

    • MrNutso

      Republicans have emphasized rebranding this year to broaden their appeal with different groups such as women and Hispanics, and then they open their mouths.

      • hypocracy1

         They realized rebranding was DoA and decided to give gerrymandering and voter-suppression laws another go…

  • OnPointComments

    The President says Trayvon Martin could have been his son, could have been him, and he lectures us.  But when four brave Americans are killed in Benghazi, and a border patrol agent and hundreds of Mexicans are killed in the “Fast and Furious” debacle, these are called phony scandals by the President.
     
    “Mother of slain Benghazi victim Sean Smith: ‘My son is dead. How could that be phony?’ ”
     http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/25/mother-of-slain-benghazi-victim-sean-smith-my-son-is-dead-how-could-that-be-phony/ 
     
    “When I was there at the ceremony of the welcoming of the caskets, both Obama and Hillary and Biden and all of the other ones, all promised me they would get back to me to tell me what happened,” Smith [Patricia Smith, mother of Sean Smith] said. “You know, not one of them, not one of them ever got back to me in any way shape or form — not by a letter, not by anything other than I got a memo stating that I didn’t need to know because I was not part of the immediate family.”
     
    “Let’s Have Justice For Ambassador Christopher Stevens”
     http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/072513-665192-carter-ham-knew-benghazi-was-terrorist-attack.htm 
     
    Excerpt:
     Oversight: Not many “phony scandals,” as the president labels Benghazi, leave four Americans dead. As the administration tries to cover up, the reality is we knew it was a terrorist attack and could have attempted a rescue.

    • Ray in VT

      The “phony scandal” was not the attack, but the supposed coverup and the supposed lack of a response from the White House.  Case in point: the scandal-mongering that you cite from IBD.

      • WorriedfortheCountry

         Every one of the ‘scandals’ involves lack of transparency and impeding investigations.  It started with the regime invoking ‘executive privilege’ in Fast and Furious after Brian Terry was killed.

        Why have none of the 30 Benghazi survivors been made available?  Part of this is on the media.  Where has 60 Minutes been?  Zimmerman should consider changing his name to Ben Ghazi to keep the media off his back.

        • Ray in VT

          I think that there are some legitimate issues regarding Fast and Furious, although it does not help to have people claiming that it is some sort of back door effort to crack down on gun rights here by stoking violence there.

          I think that Benghazi has gotten a pretty decent amount of attention, but, again, when you have people shouting conspiracy and coverup it does not help one’s cause, especially considering some of the significant misinformation that has been pushed by certain media outlets.  If Zimmerman really wants to be ignored, then Iraq Violence would be a more appropriate, although less conventional, name.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

            The Benghazi case is amazing.  I suspect it was because it was in the midst of an election that the admin attempted to distort and distract with the silly administration youtube video storyline.  If the media wasn’t ‘in the bag’ during the election end game they NEVER could have gotten away with it.

            There were many mistakes in Benghazi — from a failed security plan to lack of response.  If the admin simply copped to these mistakes then maybe it would be an embarrassment for Hillary but it wouldn’t have risen to a ‘scandal’.  Like most scandals it is the coverup that causes you problems.  I think there are still many unanswered questions.  Why was there a large CIA mission in Benghazi?  Were they running guns to Syria?

            “Could you repeat that Candy?”

          • Ray in VT

            Well, there, I think, is a part of what does a disservice to those seeking answers to the questions surrounding the Benghazi attack.  All of this talk of the administration “making up” the video storyline or persecuting the guy who was behind the video.  Those things have only become a scandal, as far as I am concerned, for political or ideological reasons.  There were initial reports of a previous protest or something, and there was unrest in Egypt over the video, and evidence disproving a protest before the attack was not retrieved for a couple of weeks.  It was a pretty chaotic situation, and there were multiple lines of intelligence, so it isn’t like that line was made up out of whole cloth, as some have suggested.

            I think that there were mistakes and there are questions to be asked, such as the CIA presence, although I don’t know if some of those details should be made public for security reasons.  I think that some were very eager to jump all over this in part because of the election season.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

            By the time Susan Rice was sent out to 5 Sunday shows they knew it wasn’t a spontaneous demonstration.  Carter Ham just said this week that they knew it was a terrorist attack within the first few hours.

            You make a good point about secrecy of operations but didn’t another administration get in trouble for running guns (see Iran-Contra).

            Do you consider Iran-Contra a ‘scandal’? Why is this one different? Because a Dem is running the regime?
            There appears to be a different standard for how actions of the regime are investigated if a D is in office or a R is in office.

          • Ray in VT

            I find it interesting, to say the least, how they “knew” that there was not a spontaneous demonstration without the video from the compound, and considering that accounts from the ground offered conflicting accounts.  The fact is that uncertainty existed, and a decent amount of the comments out of the administration acknowledged that.

            I do consider Iran-Contra to be a scandal.  The Reagan administration was, after all, dealing in drugs and weapons with terrorists in violation of the law.  Now, if this administration is shown to have similarly violated similar laws, then it would be a scandal.  I agree on the last point.  There seems to be a very high standard from some quarters regarding this President, which stands in stark contrast to how many similar figures held his immediate predecessor.

        • OnPointComments

          The “most transparent administration in history” has managed to find the survivors of the Benghazi attack, but only to get them to sign nondisclosure agreements.

          • HonestDebate1

            You would think he would be outraged and demand answers, and not to just Benghazi, all of it. So far there’s been nothing but paid leaves and promotions. I hope Hillary doesn’t get her promotion for the Benghazi debacle in ’16.

    • StilllHere

      Apparently he couldn’t have been Sean Smith or his father.

    • northeaster17

      Your problem is that Issa has no credibility. He’s all hat and no cattle.

      • hennorama

        Issa’s  not even “hat.”  

        He’s no hat, no cattle, all hair dye.

  • arydberg

    Our heroes have become criminals and our criminals have become heroes.    This does not bode well for the future.    

  • StilllHere

    If Obama cares about the economy, he should stop doing whatever Robert Rubin tells him to and not nominate Larry Summers for Fed Chair.

    • WorriedfortheCountry

       Is he considering Larry Summers?  Didn’t Obama fire Summers because of the failed recovery?

      • StilllHere

        That’s the word according to Ezra Klein.

    • jimino

      Hey, we agree on something!

      But I’m guessing you wouldn’t be happy with Krugman or Reich or someone with their point of view.

      • StilllHere

        You’re right, no amateurs.

        • PeterBoyle

           Kruegman is no amature.  But I would like to see Paul Volker at Treasury and Kruegman at the Fed.  Neither are amatures and both are sane.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             Krugman is a joke and is intellectually dishonest.

          • PeterBoyle

             With A Nobel Prize in Economics he is no joke.  I trust him more than anyone else.  With Volker in Treasury we would finally get some meaningful regulation and a sane economic policy.  The actual ‘joke’ is republican insistence on Supply Side thinking and ‘austerity’ for those not in the top 10%. 
             

          • StilllHere

            Please, Obama’s got a Nobel prize, proving it’s political and cheapening its importance beyond repair.  Krugman supposedly did some work on trade economics, not monetary policy, otherwise he’s a political slimeball.

          • jimino

            If that is your take from what Krugman said, then you really are stupid: incapable of comprehending sarcasm or  the concept of using an analogy to illustrate a point.  And that’s not a personal attack, it’s just the sad truth. 

          • WorriedfortheCountry

            I’ve read enough of Krugman and seen him enough on ABC This week to know he is a smug jerk.

            I do wonder what Krugman and Bernacke talk about in the Princeton faculty lounge.  I guarantee you that it is nothing like what we see on This Week.

      • WorriedfortheCountry

        Krugman is probably smart enough to never take the job because he knows he would be held to account for his policy decisions.

        I’m not sure Reich is smart enough to under this so he’d probably take  the job.

  • WorriedfortheCountry

    Students turned away from Obama speech yesterday simply because they were wearing Tea Party shirts.  They even had tickets to the event.

    The taxpayers shelled out $1M+ for Obama to give this speech.  Supposedly this speech was official business and not a campaign event.  Is this still America?

    http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/354434/college-republicans-denied-admittance-obama-speech-nathan-harden

    • Ray in VT

      I guess that they had to stand in the “free speech zone” pioneered by his predecessor.  I don’t care for this sort of thing, but were you outraged when protesters were made to stand in certain places so that when former President Bush passed through he would not see people protesting him or his policies?

      http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/free-speech-zone/

      • StilllHere

        Gotcha, relativism.

        • Ray in VT

          Not an issue when a Republican does it, gotcha.

          • StilllHere

            Clinton started it.

          • Ray in VT

            I’m surprised that he had time to start anything, given that he was supposedly spending so much of his time hiding bodies in Arkansas.

          • StilllHere

            Which is why I guess it’s ok for Obama to try to hide the Benghazi bodies.  Now I get it.

          • Ray in VT

            They’ve hidden the bodies?  Who knew.  You must have the really secret clearance to even know about that sort of stuff.

      • WorriedfortheCountry

         I thought Obama won the election.  Why all the campaign events?

        Obama claims there are many republicans that agree with his proposals.  Can he name one?   Looking at his calendar he doesn’t meet with Dems in Congress let alone GOP members.

        This is clearly about 2014.  He has given up on governing unless he has both houses of congress.  You don’t go out and demonize the other side if you want to work with them.  It is both sad and sick.

          Why not work on something useful like tax reform and simplification?  I’m sure he could get something done there if we was willing to give up on massive additional tax increases.  And guess what, the economy might benefit.

        http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/07/25/obama_a_lot_of_reporters_told_me_my_ideas_sound_great.html

        • Duras

          Presidents making speeches is so outside tradition….

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             And there is so little time for those speeches. Martha’s Vineyard is only a few weeks away.

          • Duras

            Ah … always the hardest hitting criticism from the right. So much substance, I’m drowning in substance.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             Well, you certainly didn’t get any ‘substance’ from Obama’s speech.

          • Duras

            Oh no, infrastructure spending in a port city will never come across to voters in Jacksonville.  Partly because they don’t know what substance is because they believe propaganda like $15 muffins and trillion dollar visits to Asia…. 

          • Ray in VT

            plus they didn’t even have a Christmas tree on the White House Christmas card.

          • Ray in VT

            I hear that he’s going to be cutting a lot of brush while he’s there.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             Somehow I doubt Obama will be raking seaweed.

            However, there are some nice private golf courses on MV.

            FORE!!!

          • Ray in VT

            490 days in Crawford in 8 years.  I’m just sayin’.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            But Shrub was at his peak, Presidenting-wise, while on vacation.

          • Ray in VT

            Agreed, although I am sure that with these sorts of times the President is connected with staff and events.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            I have not heard an update in the # of rounds of golf played recently but last I heard oboma was in the lead

          • Ray in VT

            I think that he is.  It pretty appalling.  How can a dude golf when we’re at war?  Bush gave it up, you know, for the troops.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            my theory is that this is his only chance to play at some of these clubs

          • Ray in VT

            Even Augusta lets his kind in now.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            perhaps he will go on the pga tour after his term.

          • Duras

            Do you want to hear substantive criticism of Obama?

            How about this: Obama initially had Dodd-Frank looking fairly close to Glass-Steagall.  Dodd-Frank was around 50 pages or so, but Wall Street blew up and Obama caved.  Obama allowed the corporate lawyers of the five biggest banks on Wall Street to revise Dodd-Frank, they blew it up into a 300 hundred page law, created protections for their own banks and made it difficult for smaller banks to navigate the law.

            That’s real criticism.  But you won’t hear it from the right because they believe in this type of bureaucracy, where Wall Street and corporations write the laws to give them competitive advantages. 

            Once again, you fall for the meaningless criticism and propaganda and can’t see the real issues because you are a pawn. 

          • WorriedfortheCountry

            Are the personal attacks necessary to make your point?

            Was Obama involved in Dodd-Frank?  My understanding is he had Lizzy Warren work on adding another huge bureaucracy in another 2000 page bill.  Was Lizzy Warren put on the job AFTER he caved on restoring Glass-Steagall?

            If you have a source that lays this out I would be interested because I’ve never heard about your ’50 page’ story before.

          • Duras

            Yes, the personal attacks are necessary because you need to get it through your head that it isn’t about Bush, Clinton, Obama etc., but about political economies … that the FDR political economy built the middle class, while the Reagan political economy is killing it along with American democracy, slowly turning us into an Owellian state and a war state.  Obama is just too spinless to get us out of it.  All that “socialism” crap is really just a code word for rich republicans saying that Obama is really a “Roosevelt.”  True, Obama may be the old school liberal that built this country, but he is too cautions and scared to get on the bully pulpit and do something about it.

            The over-regulation of the 1970s was a far lesser evil than the regulation of Washington by Wall Street.  There are two types of bureaucracy, and the one today is extremely anti-democracy, the product of massive corruption, and began with Ronald Reagan.   

            As for the Dodd-Frank event, I saw it on Frontline.  But you can google “Obama handing Dodd-Frank to Wall Street Lawyers” to find multiple sources.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             I couldn’t disagree with you more about RR and FDR.

            Look at the power of the State in DC.  Metro DC is the richest in the country.  RR saw the dangers of the big State and he was blocked at every attempt to reign it in.  Bush, Clinton, and Obama are all big government Statists.  Sorry, but RR had it just about right.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            You really have some fanatasies about the accumulation of political power and military spending during the latter stages of the Cold War.

          • Duras

            Reagan was the first to allow corruption. 

            When Reagan came around, all of the sudden government stopped blocking corporate mergers. 

            Reagan deregulated the credit cards, so people can go deeper into debt, which helped create the bubble that blew in 08. 

            No one, destroyed private property in this country like Ronald Reagan.  Now, due to the radical macro-economic changes made in the 1980s, no one in this country owns private property besides menial goods. 

            The corruption, the high college tuition, the anti-intellectualism, the gutting of the middle class began with that genocidal maniac Ronald Reagan – the real American Communist.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

            Wow!!!

          • Steve__T

             Don’t forget the one thing that still hangs o9ver our heads.
            http://prizedwriting.ucdavis.edu/past/2008-2009/201cstar-wars201d-the-strategic-defense-initiative

          • Duras

            Also, it took FDR to put Glass-Steagall in place and don’t you forget that.  He was are most liberal-progressive president and he was a sonofab****.  

            Seriously, wake up and realize the presidents who made this country great were the most liberal-progressive: Lincoln, Roosevelt, and Roosevelt.  Freedom in this country means that we keep the rich on not just a leash, but a chock collar (not the other way around).   

             

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             FDR was a great wartime leader.  He floundered greatly during the great recession.

            FDR did sign the Glass-Steagall act but I believe he didn’t have much to do with it since it was passed during the lame duck session.

            Also, our great growth of the middle class had more to do with our industrial dominance post WWII than any FDR policy.
            However, feel free to put him on a pedestal.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            Time to clear brush on the pig farm.

        • Ray in VT

          I think that it is likely an attempt to keep his agenda on the front page and to maybe provide some hometown pressure on members of Congress over their recess.  If one wants to talk about demonizing, let us look at the ways in which some members of Congress have talked about the President, and please let me know how he should deal with that.  I don’t think that there is much room for talk with many members of the GOP caucus.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             Isn’t the President supposed to be above it all?  Reid and Pelosi spent 24/7 sniping at Bush.  Much of the sniping is just noise. Presidents are supposed try and bring us together.  Presidents have the power.

            My sense is the people (and many in the media) are sick of the perpetual campaign and that is why Obama’s approval has now sunk below Bush’s at this point in his second term.

          • Ray in VT

            Presidents probably should be, but I don’t see that happening, especially in the current environment, given how partisan things have become. Gallup seems to show Obama up slightly in the 18th quarter of his presidency, although during this exact week it looks like Bush was up 49-47, but let us not forget that Bush’s approval took quite a bit of a hit after that, never reaching that level again, and beginning to hover in the low 40s by September of 2005.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            its pretty bad if being slightly better than bush counts as a win 

          • Ray in VT

            Agreed, but a win is a win in sports, even if it is an ugly one.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            The constant drum of half the commercial media shietstorm does have its affect. But hey, you’re not a Republican, just an open-minded TruePrincipledConservative. So you probably don’t know what it’s like to be part of an ignorant low-information herd.

        • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

          he just keeps fundraising which is now the only important thing in politics

      • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

        I was and am offended by the concept of free speech zones. I thought America was a free speech zone and I thought oboma was supposed to be better than bush?

        • Ray in VT

          I thought the same thing (about America being a free speech zone).  I would like to know more about this particular incident (i.e. something not from a GOP source), and whereas I do think that this is much less of an offense than the “free speech zones”, it is still on that spectrum, and it should not happen with public events.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            that can be frustrating about these types of stories. for some reason the liberal media wont report them so we only  have right wing media to report many things but then many people dismiss them out of hand. the same thing happens in reverse. and then other times both sides ignore or lie about a story. those are the important ones

          • Ray in VT

            That certainly can be true, although it is also true that sometimes when something is being pushed by partisan media sources the reason that it isn’t getting wider attention is that there isn’t anything to it.  Sometimes it can be tough to get to the bottom of things enough to know if it really is fire or if it is only smoke.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            the most important stories are the ones ignored by both. that’s what we really need to pay attention to. its called misdirection.

    • hennorama

      WftC – The original report, at http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/14098/ says

      “WARRENSBURG – Ten College Republicans were dubbed a security threat and refused admittance to President Barack Obama’s speech at the University of Central Missouri on Wednesday.

      “Despite the fact that the students had tickets to the event, security personnel turned them away at the door to the recreation center where Obama gave a speech on economic policy, telling the group it wasn’t about their politics but the president’s safety, State Treasurer of the College Republicans Courtney Scott told The College Fix.”

      No mention as to who “dubbed [them] a security threat.” Was it local security, the Secret Service, or someone else?

      This has the aroma of censorship, but without further info, one only has the perspective of the writer of the article, who seems to have an agenda.

      Mr. White describes himself on linkedin.com thusly:

      “Christopher D. White’s Summary

      -I have an established blogs at WorldPress.com and Young Americans for Liberty. The blogs, which can be found at zanderdialectic.worldpress.com and yaliberty.org, respectively, have been picked up, on a number of occasions, by the online newspaper The Capitalist Leadership Daily.

      -The blogs entails dissecting, analyzing and vivisecting the news and politics of the day. The showcase my adroit English skills, raconteur skills and ability to connect disparate and complex concepts to an attentive audience.

      –Along with blogging at WordPress and YAL, I also started writing for the College Fix, which is a media outlet that gathers written contributions from college students from across America”

      See:
      http://www.linkedin.com/in/christopherdwhite1

      Mr. White is “Missouri State Chairman at Young Americans for Liberty.”

      “Young Americans for Liberty” says this in the [Mission] section of their website, in part:

      “We inherit a corrupt, coercive world that has lost respect for voluntary action. Our government has failed and dragged our country into moral decay. The political class dominates the agenda with a violent, callous, controlling grip. For this we do not stand.

      “WE, as Young Americans for Liberty believe:

      that government is the negation of liberty;”

      See:
      http://www.yaliberty.org/about/mission

      And the publication Mr. White wrote this article for, ‘The College Fix’ also seems to have an agenda. This is their tagline:

      “Original. Student-Reported. Your Daily Dose of RIGHT-minded Campus News”

      Those are some rather large grains of salt, wouldn’t you agree?

      • brettearle

        Henn–

        The National Review has got to be faulted for not probing as to the specific reasons for why, those in charge on site, regarded it as a security threat.

        The Obama administration has to be faulted, as well, as to why they aren’t  being more specific about this matter–so as to offer disclaimers about the possibility of censorship.

        Here’s the crux–for me, at least:

        Obama’s side does not offer an adequate explanation–even though they SHOULD know what the obvious perception will be, without further explanation.

        A biased, GOP suspicion would be that the handlers on-site don’t want to admit censorship.

        A biased speculation, for pro-Obama advocates, might be that this is simply yet another awkward oversight–where adequate public relations spin is lacking.

        And yet it is troubling, in a way, to believe that the President’s organizers would ignore what is otherwise, a glaring and disconcerting puzzle.

        On the other hand, we have a Conservative publication, who clearly needs to keep its journalistic integrity in tact; but is yet exercising a knee-jerk exploitation–in the absence of an adequate explanation, from the other side.

        This is because the REVIEW has NOT given itself a chance to respect its own supposed integrity:

        Why pounce, opportunistically, on an incident that might be perceived as deplorable Suppression–BEFORE actually going to the sources and ASKING, POINT BLANK, as to what IS going on?

        If they CAN’T do that, then the publication is just as guilty as the Obama side–thereby, forcing the REVIEW to look like yet another Rag, who falls for a sensationalized story, without full substantiation….in order to fit the suitability of their exaggerated political diagnosis.

        In the meantime, Obama looks to his adversaries, as yet another figurehead from behind the Iron Curtain.

        The whole thing is both petty and significant.

        • WorriedfortheCountry

           The NatReview blog post (yes a 130 word blog post) DID mention that they were rejected “under the guise of security”.

          So they report the event on a blog post without doing complete research on the ‘other side’ and that makes them “just as guilty”?  Please!!!

          • brettearle

            Wrong again, Buster.

            They are not too naive not to probe further.

            The idea of blatant censorship does NOT pass the smell test–if speculated by a major publication, WITHOUT proper follow-up.

            Especially when there are irresponsible inferences/jokes, linking
            Obama to North Korean MO.

            If Obama says Security and the “National Review” says Censorship, then THE REVIEW HAS AN OBLIGATION TO FIND OUT MORE ABOUT THIS SO-CALLED SECURITY CLAIM, BEFORE THEY ARRIVE AT THE OPPOSITE CONCLUSION.

            It is PURE irresponsible journalism.

            PURE.  And nothing less.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             If you are so upset then report it to their ombudsman.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            “Guise of security”.

            That’s some crackerjack reporting right there.

            I remember all the National Review crocodile tears and tilted language when a bumper sticker would get people kicked out of a Shrub event.

          • jefe68

            Funny how the regressive right posting here forgets that.

          • hennorama

            WftC – my reply to your original post included a link to the original article (as did the NR blog post you cited):

            http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/14098/

            My criticism is that there was absolutely no information in either the NR blog post, or the original article linked above, as to who may have determined there was “a security threat.” Was it local security, the Secret Service, or someone else?

            That’s a rather large detail that was overlooked, don’t you think? What if it was some local or state police officer, or a member of the security staff of the University of Central Missouri?

            The answer might make a considerable difference to the reader, and indeed might make the writer reconsider whether the incident had any news value whatsoever.

          • WorriedfortheCountry

             I agree.  You ask good questions.

          • hennorama

            WftC – TY.

            But my questions are usually pretty basic. You know – who-what-when-where-how-why?

            Believe it or not, unlike myself, Christopher White, the original writer, is a GRADUATE Journalism student, at the University of Missouri-Columbia.

            See again:
            http://www.linkedin.com/in/christopherdwhite1

          • HonestDebate1

            Or what if the detail was purposely omitted and we aren’t supposed to know who or why? What if this administration had a history of targeting the Tea Party? What if the President was known to avoid exposing  himself to opposing views?

          • hennorama

            Bonehead Test – TYFYR.

            Indeed, as I wrote to [brettearle], one must consider whether anyone involved in Presidential security would breathe a single word about the details of their threat assessment criteria, to ANYONE, especially to any journalists.

            Next, the Tea Shindiggers aren’t a political party, so let’s stop using that term.

            As to “targeting” by “this administration” – please.

            As to President Obama being “known to avoid exposing himself to opposing views” – yeah, right.

            Lastly, please be careful in the use of the term “exposing himself” in any way, unless you are referring to the recent ridiculous state of “affairs.”

            TYAFYR.

          • HonestDebate1

            The Tea partiers are patriots exercising their Constitutional duty to speak out freely against an overreaching government. Obama’s a wuss.

          • hennorama

            1 Hot Dense Beat – (feel free to steal that one) – I’m in a bit of a magnanimous mood, so let me show you where we agree, OK?

            You wrote “The Tea partiers are patriots exercising their Constitutional duty to speak out freely against an overreaching government. Obama’s a wuss.”

            My edit, which indicates the ideas I agree with:

            The Tea “partiers” are patriots exercising their Constitutional duty[/right] to speak out freely against [their] government. Obama’s [our President].

            TYFYR.

          • jefe68

            And Occupiers are Americans exercising their Constitutional right to oppose corporate over reaching and infulence.

          • HonestDebate1

            No, they’re just selfish.

          • jefe68

            What if the world was flat?

            Oh wait the tea party already endorses that idea.

        • hennorama

          brettearle – TYFYR, and well said.

          It took me all of, I dunno – thirty seconds or so – to see the lack of “whodunnit” in the original article, and maybe three minutes to figure out exactly who the writer was, and his obvious agenda. That his own LinkedIn profile makes him look like an oblivious braggadocious fool was a bonus.

          OTOH, as you point out, “the optics’ are not good for the administration, to say the least.

          Again, well said.

          • brettearle

            Thanks….

        • hennorama

          brettearle – upon further consideration, a thought occured:

          one must consider whether anyone involved in Presidential security would breathe a single word about the details of their threat assessment criteria.

          To ANYONE, especially any journalists.

          • brettearle

            I see your point.

            But, at least they could have said what you have said above.

            Or they could have been slightly more specific–but still brief and still reasonably generic about it.

          • hennorama

            brettearle – right.

            Something simple like “A Presidential security spokesperson indicated that they never comment on details of Presidential security.”

            At least then the reader would know the question was asked.

    • HonestDebate1

      He’s a lightweight, opposing views should be welcomed.

    • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

      despicable

    • hennorama

      WftC – a final comment:
      The NR blog post you linked to indicated the students were turned away due to “security concerns.”  The original article the NR blog post was based on said “security
      personnel turned them away … telling the group it wasn’t about
      their politics but the president’s safety…”

      Both “articles” strongly implied the reason was as you described, but never stated it.  You inferred your conclusion that they were “turned away from [the] Obama speech yesterday simply because they were wearing Tea Party shirts” without any direct statement of fact.

    • StilllHere

      Thin-skinned.  The guy’s presidency is going around the drain and he’s struggling to deflect.  

  • Ray in VT

    I don’t think that I have seen the issue of nominations much in the news this week, but here is something to consider:

    http://judicialnominations.org/statistics

    • hennorama

      Ray in VT –

      According to americanprogress.org, on Nov.8, 2012,

      “Nearly two-thirds of the nation’s population—170 million Americans—today are living in a jurisdiction that has been declared a judicial emergency* meaning that in courtrooms across the country there aren’t enough judges to hear the cases that are piling up. “

      See:
      http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/civil-liberties/report/2012/11/08/11914/federal-judicial-emergencies/

      Per the National Women’s Law Center, there’s a 10 percent vacancy rate, and 35 “judicial emergencies”

      “July 26, 2013

      “There are currently 85 vacancies on the federal district and appellate courts.[1] With over 850 authorized judicial seats, this represents a ten percent vacancy rate. This alarmingly high vacancy rate has persisted for over four years; indeed, the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service recently determined that we are in the longest period of historically high vacancy rates in 35 years.[2] In addition, over 40 percent of the existing vacancies (35) are in courts so overburdened that they have been designated “judicial emergencies” by the Administrative Office of the U.S. Courts.[3]

      See:
      http://www.nwlc.org/resource/vacancy-crisis-federal-judiciary-whats-stake-women#_edn1 (The Vacancy Crisis in the Federal Judiciary: What’s at Stake for Women)

      http://www.uscourts.gov/JudgesAndJudgeships/JudicialVacancies/JudicialEmergencies.aspx (JUDICIAL EMERGENCIES)

      http://www.afj.org/judicial-selection/judicial-selection-snapshot.pdf (JUDICIAL SELECTION SNAPSHOT)

      • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

        that is alarming. I wonder why the mainstream media doe not say anything about it

        • hennorama

          Futo Buddy – Perhaps you should direct your inquiry to them.

          My answer, as usual – $$$$$.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            have you got their number? someone should alert them. I have a few other things they should perhaps look into

          • hennorama

            FB – you’re really getting the hang of the sarcasm thing. Well done.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            $$$$$?

            You’ve taken Sgt. Snorkel’s advanced class in comic-strip swearing, I see.

          • hennorama

            TF – TY for bringing ol’ Sarge to mind, as he’s been quite absent.

            But you may have misunderstood. I was replying to FB’s comment, “I wonder why the mainstream media doe[s] not say anything about it.”

            I bottom-lined it – $$$$$.

            AKA – not enough eyes and ears will be attracted to the issue of judicial vacancies, even if some are described as emergencies, to justify coverage.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

            Oops. Got it now.

      • Ray in VT

        Well, we can’t have Obama packing the courts by filling vacancies.  Filibustering or delaying was really terrible when it happened to upwards of 6% of Bush’s nominees, but it’s defending democracy and liberty (or something) when it happens to 3 times as many of Obama’s people.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      Don’t worry, I’m sure the superhero Bork-Man and all his hack buddies will fly in to save us.

      If only a Democratic president wasn’t sooooo partisan as to nominate a Democrat once in a while.

      • Ray in VT

        Nana nana nana nana, Bork-Man!  Pow!  Bam!

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

          Hey, I shouldn’t be so flip. I’m sure Bork-man’s got plenty of “Boy Blunders”* out there to carry on his work.

          *I’m sure the Penguin (Burgess Meredith) said this in the ’60s show. Surprising what the brain just can’t get rid of.

          • Ray in VT

            I loved the old Batman show as a kid.  My grandmother had cable, and we didn’t.  Whenever we visited it seemed like I could always find a Batman episode.  It is funny how some things stick.  I made a joke to my wife about something that I call one of my brother’s cows, and she didn’t get it.  I compared the cow to the bad guy from the “old” (1980s) cartoon Dungeons and Dragons.

  • stillin

    Where is the 18 yr. old American valdictorian hiker from Oklaoma? Missing in Banos’ Equador from a hike with his parent and little brother…the trip being a graduation gift. Can you do an hour on August Reiger…where is August Reiger?

  • PeterBoyle

    Obama is proof we need a viable 3rd party in the US.  He has been such a disappointment, but still better than either of his opponents would have been. 

    • Duras

      We just went through a recession without reforming the systemic problems.  After democrats just allowed student loan interest rates to increase, and the Snowden thing, and the recent bill to curtail the Patriot Act that many democrats voted “no,” I think it is better to just vote for a third party than to let the democrats slowly allow republicans to kill the middle class.  I rather republicans just destroy this country right away, so we can get some social movements going.  And the age of racial scapegoating (otherwise known as Reaganism) will be over.

      • 228929292AABBB

         Reagan is dead and has been.  President Obama is failing and betraying those of us who supported him all on his own.   Even Reagan’s most ardent devotees would admit he’s not powerful enough to orchestrate Obama’s failures and hypocrisy from beyond the grave.  The social movement you’re waiting for isn’t going to start until we become a little more honest.  President Obama is not what we thought, that’s the real problem.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

          “Reagan is dead and has been”?

          I’ll believe that when the George Wills and Nooners reset their compasses to Saint Reagan’s failures (outright genuine, and compromising with lefties), rather than tut their disapproval of every time “Obama would have been a better president if he did something the way Reagan did”.

          The next time Obama takes a trip, I’ll remember the bold Reaganistas saying “A president gets to take a vacation, quidchebidchin”, and when President Obama (or Clinton) do so, it’s “Why didn’t he go to some Republican or swing state?”

        • StilllHere

          Democrats are afraid of dead guys and guys who’ve been out of politics for 6 years.  They’ve got a million excuses.

      • StilllHere

        Please, I had to pay 8% on my student loans, and people today are whining about 3%, give me a break.  Taxes are killing the middle class and with Democrats spending, it’s only going to get worse.  When does the age of responsibility begin?

        • disqus_xJo1iwE4DM

           Taxes are NOT killing the middle class. The upper class is.

          • HonestDebate1

            When you see a fat man standing next to a skinny man, do you assume the fat guy took the skinny guy’s food?

          • StilllHere

            Wow, that’s a lot of baggage.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

          Other people are “whining”? Really?

          And continue comparing one interest rate to another without the context of the prime rate or bank savings account rates at the time.

  • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy
  • Potter

    I originally thought that Weiner was going to make it, regardless of his lapse, for his positive qualities. But now that his lapses are plural, it seems as though it’s an addiction that he can’t control. And that would not be a good thing for a public official such as Mayor of New York to have. (Pardon my understatement.) I think the people of NYC realize this.

    • HonestDebate1

      I’m certainly not rooting for him but I’m not counting him out either. I can’t agree that it’s an addiction beyond his control. That’s just an excuse, he doesn’t have to do it. 

  • hennorama

    Much
    has been made of the issue of race in America, and how it relates to
    crime.

    Let
    me preface the following by saying I am in no way an expert on
    criminology, sociology, economics, or any combinations of those
    fields of study.

    Several
    nationally recognized conservatives have recently spoken about
    statistics related to African-Americans and crime. In many instances
    their words could be fairly described as “painting with a broad
    brush.”

    The
    term “painting with a broad brush” can also be described as
    “guilt by association.”

    I’m
    not a fan of such rhetorical devices. As an exercise, I tried to
    recreate one. It took several attempts, as my mind simply doesn’t
    operate in that manner.

    (Curious
    readers can see my feeble attempt here, as well as numerous related
    posts, on this thread. Be forewarned – there are a total of 11 and
    54 comments, respectively, on these threads, as of 3:35 AM Saturday,
    July 27, 2013 (GMT):

    http://onpoint.wbur.org/2013/07/19/week-in-the-news-zimmerman-abortion-filibuster#comment-974169843

    http://onpoint.wbur.org/2013/07/19/week-in-the-news-zimmerman-abortion-filibuster#comment-971384791

    ==========

    A
    wise person once told me –

    “When
    you start to generalize, stop for a second, then put the word “all”
    in front of what you are generalizing about. Change it to an
    absolute. If your words still make sense, then go ahead; if not –
    it’s time to re-think.”

    For
    example, if you begin a phrase with “Southerners are …” stop,
    then change it to “ALL Southerners are …“

    If
    everything after the ellipsis still makes sense, then go right ahead.

    This
    is not the easiest thing to do, of course. We all make assumptions,
    and we all have our biases.

    I’d
    like to turn this around, and to begin with statements that don’t use
    a broad brush.

    The
    FBI says the following on their website, for 2011:

    “Concerning
    murder victims for whom race was known, 50.0 percent were black, 46.0
    percent were white, and 2.6 percent were of other races. Race was
    unknown for 175 victims. (Based on Expanded Homicide Data Table 2.)”

    “Of
    the offenders for whom race was known, 52.4 percent were black, 45.2
    percent were white, and 2.4 percent were of other races. The race was
    unknown for 4,077 offenders. (Based on Expanded Homicide Data Table
    3.)”

    See:

    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/offenses-known-to-law-enforcement/expanded/expanded-homicide-data

    Please
    note the very important qualifying phrase in both cases – “for whom
    race was known.”

    Allow
    me to comment:

    COMMENT
    1: Compared to the 2012 estimated percentage of Americans who are
    “Black or African American alone” (13.1%), and the percentage of
    Americans who are “White alone” (77.9%), the percentages of the
    VICTIMS whose race is known are disproportionate.

    COMMENT
    2: Compared to the 2012 estimated percentage of Americans who are
    “Black or African American alone” (13.1%), and the percentage of
    Americans who are “White alone” (77.9%), the percentages of the
    OFFENDERS whose race is known are disproportionate.

    These
    comments are accurate, and don’t make millions of Americans guilty by
    association.

    If
    we can begin a discussion there, we’ve already come very, very far.

    ==========

    On
    a related note, I’m personally determined to do my part to break down
    barriers and to promote unity over divisiveness. I recently wrote of
    the concept of “Otherly Love” here:

    http://onpoint.wbur.org/2013/07/22/race-in-america-today#comment-973026927

    My
    personal effort will extend over this weekend and beyond. I’m going
    to a ballgame this weekend, and am determined to at least greet and
    shake the hand of every single person in the section of the ballpark
    where my seats are located.

    Everyone
    can step outside their routine and perhaps even their comfort zone
    when they feel safe. My suggestion to everyone is to extend yourself
    a tiny bit while you’re in a safe environment. Reach out to “the
    other.” Greet and meet someone new, someone who doesn’t look like
    you, act like you, talk like you, dress like you.

    Turn
    “the other” into “the teeny bit more familiar.” Turn
    “them” into “kinda like us.”

    Practice
    some Otherly Love.

    President
    Obama’s last words still echo in my mind – “…along this long,
    difficult journey, we’re becoming a more perfect union — not a
    perfect union, but a more perfect union.”

    Change
    begins with me, and with you. Contribute to a more perfect union,
    one union at a time.

    • HonestDebate1

      Painting with a broad brush is fine as long as you keep the ideology properly categorized. 

      The South is racist. 
      The Tea partiers are too.
      Fox is a shill for Conservatives.
      Black kid’s biggest fear are white racist.
      All Muslims are kind-hearted and harmless.
      All tax hikes are revenue.
      All Republicans want in your bedroom.
      All blacks are oppressed.
      All Christians are religious zealots.
      All Women want abortions.
      All Obama’s policies are good faith efforts to heal our Country.

      • jimino

        Pretty bizarre for someone who incessantly proclaims “don’t tell me what I think.”  

        • HonestDebate1

          Think what you want, as long as you stick to the script you’re gold.

          I don’t accept the premise that soberly assessing threats, economics and demographic trends is painting with a broad brush. I’m more concerned with the big sweep under the rug.

        • jefe68

          Oh did you not get the memo?
          He’s a special.

      • hennorama

        Good morning sir. How’s your Saturday going so far?

        The larger point being made is this – if your goal is agreement, start off by being agreeable.

        This is not the easiest thing to do, of course. We all make assumptions, and we all have our biases.

        I’d like to turn this around, and to begin with statements that don’t use a broad brush.

        If you’re looking for divisions, there certainly are plenty of topics to go around. But there are underlying consensuses that get lost in the airing of extreme viewpoints.

        The South is a great place to visit.
        The TEA “partiers” are diverse, vocal, and motivated individuals and groups.
        Fox is not “fair and balanced.”
        Black kid’s’ biggest fear is their grandmother’s disapproval.
        All Muslims are human beings.
        All tax hikes are … there’s nothing that “All tax hikes are” except perhaps “generally unpopular.”
        All Republicans want … there’s nothing that “All Republicans want.”
        All blacks are … there’s nothing that “All blacks are”, except “black.”
        All Christians are … there’s nothing that “All Christians are,” except Christian.
        All Women want …. yeah, good luck with that one.
        All Obama’s policies are controversial to some Americans.

        In a quest to find “things Americans have in common,” I came across an NPR program titled “What Do Americans Have in Common?”

        This program was from back in the halcyon days of yesteryear, when America was united – November 15, 2004, in the midst of Bush v. Gore.

        One guest, Michael Ledeen, the author of ‘Tocqueville on American Character’ and an American Enterprise Institute scholar, said:

        “Americans are uniquely suspicious of government. We don’t like government. I mean – look at the status polls – who has high status In America? People with high status are people such as doctors; people with low status are people like politicians. Politicians have ALWAYS had low status in America. And Tocqueville again – he’s our national psychiatrist – Tocqueville noticed back in the 19th century that the best people in America don’t go into politics, and that’s because government has always had relatively low status in this country. So we don’t trust government, we don’t want government meddling.

        “On the other hand, most Americans believe government is obliged to do certain things for us, to provide a safety net for the weak and the poor and disadvantaged and so forth, and to provide for the national defense and so on. So here again there are things we want, and many of the things we want require big government, but when we get big government we don’t like it because we’re distrustful of government, especially big government.

        “So there we are again.”

        See:
        http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4170775

        So one might conclude that the things we most have in common are contradictory attitudes.

        Still, we’re all in this together. If we can try to talk WITH each other rather than PAST each other, we might actually find some common ground.

        Enjoy your day.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Cacimbo-Smith/1142235495 Cacimbo Smith

    Major Garrett spouted the Obama administration talking points verbatim today.  He always leans left, but seems to be tipping further. If he continues on his current trajectory his next stop will be MSNBC.

    • JONBOSTON

      Sorry but I disagree with your comments about Major Garrett. I believe he’s one of the few guests on Ashbrook’s Week in the News review whose comments are “fair and balanced”. On the other hand , Ashbrook’s other guest, Annie Lowery, and Jack Beatty are worthless. Beatty is nothing more than a collection of left wing talking points mouthed under a pretense of objectivity. Their review of Obama’s pathetic “economics” speech was laughable. What Obama needs is to return to school, take Econ 101 and then spend several years interning in the private sector. I’m constantly amazed at how ignorant our pretend president is about the private economy and the way it works.

  • JONBOSTON

    Listening to Obama’s pathetic discourse on the problems with the economy and the ignoramuses standing behind him reminds me of this quote which may have been said by Ben Stein:

    “The danger to America is not Barack Obama, but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency. It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr Obama, who is merely a symptom of what ails America. Blaming the prince of fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools, such as those who made him their president.”

    Obama is nothing more than an incompetent divisive empty suit. He gives nice speeches filled with platitudes that accomplish nothing. America’s first affirmative action president is enabled by a Washington press corp that refuses to challenge him on anything, especially his comments about  “phony Washington scandals”. “Leading from behind” should be the everlasting commentary on his presidency.

    • brettearle

      Please list all of Bush II’s economic accomplishments that led us all down the primrose path of prosperity and upturn….

      • HonestDebate1

        When the tech bubble burst on 3/10/2000 it was devastating but the Clinton recession was shallow. We then survived the annihilation of the financial center of the universe on 9/11. The surplus was returned to the people in the form of $300 checks. This gave relief to the poorest right away. We then removed 6 million of the poorest from the tax rolls altogether and sent the bill to the rich. That happened in 2001 but when the rates were lowered across the board in 2003, revenue went up by over a half trillion by 2007 which still holds the all time record for revenue. The unemployment rate went down for 52 straight months.

        So there’s that.

        • Mike_Card

          It isn’t a factual point, but a lot of people say the tech bubble burst in Sep or Oct of 2000; that’s my bench mark.
          There’s much libertarian rumble about how Clinton is really the cause of it all, but all the evidence is revisionist history that ignores Clinton’s political moves to compromise with the Bircher elements who were hell-bent on getting Clinton impeached. The impeachment movement, btw, was propelled by the John Birch children–the Koch brothers.
          We’re not dealing with historical facts here. This is all politics. So…there’s that, too.

      • JONBOSTON

        As Greg mentions , Bush inherited the burst of the dot-com bubble which triggered a recession and then dealt with the downturn caused by 9-11. In May 2003 Bush cut capital gains taxes and dividends. Growth averaged nearly 4% over the next three years, the jobless rate fell from 6.3% in June 2003 to 4.4% in October 2006, and real wages began to grow despite rising food and energy prices.

        Budget deficits did fall mid-decade as tax revenues soared with expansion. In fiscal 2007, the deficit hit $161 billion, or an economically trivial 1.2% of GDP.

        Yes Lehman Bros and its aftermath happened on Bush’s watch. But to blame him entirely for that event is strictly partisan garbage. The fiasco never would have happened had Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac not promoted programs and policies that encouraged home ownership by borrowers who could least afford to own one.. Absent sub-prime mortgages, you avoid the derivatives meltdown.

        Obama hasn’t any fundamental understanding of the economy. He doesn’t offer any ideas on how to grow the economy–indeed his programs do nothing more than transfer wealth from producers to takers. Eventually, as Margaret Thatcher said about socialism, you run out of other people’s money.

        Now tell me , please explain Obama’s plan to grow the economy….

      • JONBOSTON

        I’m still waiting for your response…..Please make the argument that Obama’s policies over the past 5 years have grown the economy, helped the middle class , reduced poverty and the number of people dependent on a government check, and created many full time decent jobs.  

        • JONBOSTON

          What no reply? Suggestion–Just make up facts and lies to support your argument–Obama does so why not you?

  • Paul_Caligiuri

    The discussion on the economy only barely touches what needs to be talked about and that is wages and income of the middle class.  This is the math; let’s say there are 200 million people with income in the US and 98% of them are middle class making less than even $100,000 a year but probably less.  These are the people who when they get a raise or a tax cut or a tax credit generally spend it on goods and services.  That is 196 million people who pump their earnings back into the economy.  The top 2%, when they get more money, save it and invest it or buy one high ticket cost item (like diamond from Africa that has little to do with the US economy).  It is also known that more money to the top 2% does not stimulate growth and more jobs.  It seems logical that if you but a little bit more money in the hands of 196 million people who will spend it on goods and services that the economy produces then this increased demand will spur the economy to growth.

    So if we look at the current picture and its logic we get “if a higher percentage of income and money goes to the top few percent and if this income transfer should increase the ecomomy then the economy will have good growth.”  But since 1980 with Reaganomics we have seen the first If statement take place but we have also seen the fallacy of the second If statement and the Then clause.

    So what needs to happen is to get more money as wages, tax credits but best by wages back into the hands of the middle class. And this can be done without prices always having to increase by making corporations pay their taxes, making scofflaws pay their taxes, and having a social movement where CEOs dont make 300 times the average worker and shareholders maybe have to earn a 10% less dividend.

    Please talk about this.

    • brettearle

      I wish your recommendations for an overhaul could happen.

      But, frankly, given DC political entrenchment, it is about as realistic as what we had hoped for with gun control–but didn’t happen–after Newtown.

    • HonestDebate1

      Implicit in your suggestion is the notion government should regulate both minimum and maximum pay scales in the private sector independent of market forces. Raising the minimum wage always hurts the poor. On the other end, I’d rather have Bill Gates making 300 times what his gazillion employees make than to do without all the jobs he created. Tax credits cost money, tax cuts don’t. Further, people are hurting, if they get a break then they should save or pay down debt, not buy wide screen TV’s. The only solution is for more people to go to work and become taxpayers.

      • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

        whats great about tech companies is the low number of employees needed. I  know a guy who worked for gates and retired at 35  a multimillionaire

        • HonestDebate1

          God bless him.

          • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

            seems to have done so thus far

    • John Cedar

      When you give tax cuts to the middle class and lower, it only stimulate the economy of china Walmart. lottery tickets and Burger King.

      You sure did gloss over the “save it and invest it” part of the top 2 percent. And those high ticket items that the high earners buy, are not apt to be diamonds but rather are Gulfstream jets multi-million dollar homes, yachts and such . All require high paid talented employees to design and build them.

      • jefe68

        The contempt and condescension that you have for the middle class is noted. Also noted is that you seem to lack an understanding that a nation of 350 million cannot be sustained by yacht and private jet building alone. 

        • John Cedar

          Your noted is wrong.
          A glib observation is nothing more than that.
          I have no illusions regarding Yacht and jet industries but do observe that some are built in the US while virtually nothing sold in Walmart is.
          And your 350MM population is wayyyy wrong too.

          • StilllHere

            That one is a waste of time.  My guess is he’s an academic as he shows no comprehension of the real economy. He would have us all working for the state.

          • jefe68

            The little troll is posting. How quaint.
            You’r guess is wrong sparky.

          • jefe68

            312 to be exact.
            Funny you still don’t seem to get the idea that without a good solid middle-class the nation’s economy is not going to grow at a decent rate. And I agree, your glib in your observations.

          • John Cedar

            I am glib but correct.
            You are glib but incorrect.
            I do get that we need a strong middle class.
            We disagree because we already have one.
            We disagree on how to get a better one.

    • OnPointComments

      It is a common fallacy that because the rich got richer, the poor got poorer.  This is nonsense.  The income and money that goes to the top few percent is not an “income transfer,” i.e., contrary to thinking of many liberals, it would not have gone to the middle class or the poor if the rich hadn’t grabbed the money first. 

      • Steve__T

         ” it would not have gone to the middle class or the poor if the rich hadn’t grabbed the money first.”

        Like many of your statements, this makes no sense . Most of what you write is like a 6′ brick wall in the middle of the Mohave Desert.

        • OnPointComments

          I was paraphrasing a false sentiment that I have read on here many times:  the belief that the greedy rich have taken more than fair share, and if they hadn’t been greedy and grabbed the money, the poor and middle class would have gotten more.  It’s not true.  The two aren’t connected, i.e., the amount of money or income earned by the rich doesn’t determine the amount of money or income earned by the poor and middle class.

  • tbphkm33

    I should keep a log next week of all the surprising facts I hear. Like this one that was on a radio show: 
    “There are currently 189,000 unsolved murders in the U.S. — with an estimated 100,000 killers walking amongst the population at large.”  

    Sure, a population of 350 million, so odds are still against that any one of us actually know one of these individuals.  Then again, if you think about it in geographical terms, that’s a lot of killers spread out across the country.  Chances are that any one of us has walked within feet of one of these individuals while say at the grocery store.  My bet is that it is not someone who looks crazy, its probably the person you would least expect.  

    So, that’s my disturbing thought of the day.  

    • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

      i doubt the distribution is even. I bet there are a lot walking around in chicago

      • Wm_James_from_Missouri

        Funny !

    • hennorama

      tbphkm33 – the numbers of unsolved murders and non-negligent homicides are indeed substantial. I would describe the 189K number as “a well-documented estimate” rather than a “fact.”

      The number is derived from a Scripps Howard News Service analysis from 2010. They analyzed data from the years 1980 through 2008, and concluded there were 184,992 unsolved murders and non-negligent homicides during that period.

      See:
      http://www.caller.com/news/2010/may/23/analysis-look-what-kinds-murders-get-solved/?print=1

      And:
      http://shns.com/home (Scripps Howard News Service homepage. I used the search feature [unsolved murder analysis]. If you just want the original story, search for [shnsnewsthree017360]. That’s their internal designation for it.)

      http://www.shns.com/hunting-serial-killers (this has an interesting Searchable database called ‘The Serial Killer Detector’)

      • tbphkm33

        Thanks, I thought about looking it up, but did not. This would actually make a great Halloween article for weekly free papers.  A profiler would be able to make educated guesses as to the geographical distribution of murders and personality types.  Does make me wonder if you would find a higher percentage in socially benefiting organizations, such as donors at blood centers.  In that they would be trying to make amends to society for what they have done.  Or heavily vested in volunteering for religious organizations. 

        OnPoint should do a show on this, it be interesting to hear what the experts have to say. 

  • John Cedar

    The fact that you believe I cannot source my assertions speaks to your inability to discern reality from your imagination.
    As always, the best sources have words like heritage in them:
    http://www.heritage.org/~/media/InfoGraphics/2012/10/SRfedspendingnumbers2012p11table1_600.ashx

    • jefe68

      The Heritage Foundation? That’s your source.
      The same Heritage Foundation that’s been caught lying to a Senate committee on OECD numbers. Not to mention a host of other misleading and skewed data designed to mislead people like yourself. Or so it would seem.

      Heritage Foundation, indeed.

      • John Cedar

        Okay, so go to the second best source…Wikipedia.
        Then get back to me and tell me which one of those numbers showing what an economic buffoon Obama is, is wrong, from the Heritage foundation chart?

  • OnPointComments

    Some people have been successful, and some have not been successful.  President Obama thinks the solution is to stop the people who are successful.
     
    “THERE’S AN ECONOMIC BOOM LURKING ONCE PRESIDENT OBAMA’S 2ND TERM ENDS”
     http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2013/07/28/theres-an-economic-boom-lurking-once-president-obamas-2nd-term-ends/ 
     
    Excerpt:The truth is Obama disdains economic growth and the middle class, because both are the progenitors of financial and political independence.  What he treasures is the neediness of government dependency, which is the progenitor of a political machine, trading government handouts for votes.
     
    In fact, if you doubled the economic growth during Obama’s first term, it would still be worse than any President since the Great Depression, worse even than under George Bush, or Jimmy Carter.
     
    For four and a half years, Mr. Obama has focused his policies on reducing inequality rather than increasing growth.  The predictable result has been more inequality and less growth.  Indeed, official U.S. government data shows inequality has been growing under President Obama, while it did not under President Bush.

  • hennorama

    Apologies
    in advance to the group for continuing this discussion about
    “painting with a broad brush” and guilt by association. The
    “painting with a broad brush” technique in this case is used to
    conflate the actions of a small group with the much larger group,
    using repetition and association.

    This
    was posted 3 days ago on last week’s Week In The News thread: (see:
    http://onpoint.wbur.org/2013/07/19/week-in-the-news-zimmerman-abortion-filibuster#comment-975753787
    )

    By
    “HonestDebate1”

    “If
    Apples were murders

    An
    homage to the algebra of Larry Elder

    “Once
    upon a time in a land where everything was a color in the rainbow,
    there was a community of apple farmers. They were 100 strong if you
    counted everyone. Revenue from the sale of apples sustained their
    needs. Apples were the life of the community. They grew red apples
    and yellow apples, every apple was precious. The yellow and red
    apples both brought the same price at market. They both had equal
    potential to sell well. The color made no difference to the buyer who
    was far more concerned with the general character of the apple. Some
    had deficiencies and some did not; some stood out… big time… both
    ways… both colors.

    “It
    was decided, despite the sacrifice to their budget, 14,000 apples
    (half red and half yellow) would be pulled off the market and eaten.
    To ensure equality, the apples to be eaten were divided evenly, 7000
    each, between the red people and the yellow people. The community
    consisted of 12 yellow people and 88 red people. This meant 12 yellow
    people got 3500 red apples and 3500 yellow apples; and 88 red people
    got 3500 red apples and 3500 yellow apples.

    “There
    was much concern over red people eating yellow apples, the yellow
    apples were the topic of discussion. Some were angry that 12 people
    got 7000 apples but the real concern was with half (not all) of the
    apples, the yellow ones. 6 yellow people ate 3500 red apples and 6
    yellow people ate 3500 yellow apples. In other words, 6% of the
    community’s population ate 50% of the yellow apples.

    “Of
    the 6 yellow people 2 were infants who did not have teeth yet, they
    couldn’t eat apples. 1 was very old and also didn’t have teeth to eat
    an apple with. This meant 3 yellow people ate half of the 7000 yellow
    apples.”

    The
    above provokes some obvious questions:

    1.
    What happened to the other “6 yellow people [who] ate 3500 red
    apples”?

    2.
    Since Mr. Elder said this at the start of his interview –

    “7,000
    murders, last year Pierce, of black people, almost all of those were
    committed by black people …,” and quickly followed that with
    “There’s 7,000 murders last year. Half – wait, wait a minute….
    half, half of the crimes of mur– ..half of the murders in this
    country are committed by black people…”

    wouldn’t
    “This [have] meant 12 yellow people got “7,000 apples … almost
    all of [which are yellow]?”

    Nice
    try, but seriously – keep your day job AND your night job.

    ==========

    Allow
    me to help, if I may. This is really easy. Anyone can play along.
    Just copy the “homage” above into your word processing software,
    then -

    Find
    apple and Replace with murder (“If Apples were murders”)

    Find
    farmers and Replace with producers

    Find
    grew and Replace with produced

    Find
    yellow people and replace with black people

    Find
    red people and replace with white (and other) people

    Find
    eat/ate and their derivations and Replace with commit/committed and
    their derivations

    Find
    and delete the red herrings – “despite the sacrifice to their
    budget, “ and “pulled off the market and “

    Here’s
    what you get:

    I
    call it “When North Carolina musician/farmers try to reason, you
    get murdersauce.”

    “Once
    upon a time in a land where everything was a color in the rainbow,
    there was a community of murder producers. They were 100 strong if
    you counted everyone. Revenue from the sale of murders sustained
    their needs. Murders were the life of the community. They produced
    red murders and yellow murders, every murder was precious. The yellow
    and red murders both brought the same price at market. They both had
    equal potential to sell well. The color made no difference to the
    buyer who was far more concerned with the general character of the
    murder. Some had deficiencies and some did not; some stood out… big
    time… both ways… both colors.

    “It
    was decided 14,000 murders (half red and half yellow) would be
    committed. To ensure equality, the murders to be committed were
    divided evenly, 7000 each, between the white (and other) people and
    the black people. The community consisted of 12 black people and 88
    white (and other) people. This meant 12 black people got 3500 red
    murders and 3500 yellow murders; and 88 white (and other) people got
    3500 red murders and 3500 yellow murders.

    “There
    was much concern over white (and other) people committing yellow
    murders, the yellow murders were the topic of discussion. Some were
    angry that 12 people got 7000 murders but the real concern was with
    half (not all) of the murders, the yellow ones. 6 black people
    committed 3500 red murders and 6 black people committed 3500 yellow
    murders. In other words, 6% of the community’s population committed
    50% of the yellow murders.

    “Of
    the 6 black people 2 were infants who did not have teeth yet, they
    couldn’t commit murders. 1 was very old and also didn’t have teeth to
    commit a murder with. This meant 3 black people committed half of the
    7000 yellow murders.”

    ==========

    This
    is what Mr. Elder actually said:

    Notice
    the repetition and associations used. 7,000 murders – twice. Black
    people – three times. Half – seven times. Murders – six times.
    Committed/committing – four times. Population – four times. The
    associations – 7,000 murders, black people, committed/committing
    murders, black people, 12% of the population, committing murders…

    “7,000
    murders last year Piers, of black people, almost all of those were
    committed by black people…” ………. “There’s 7,000
    murders last year. Half – wait, wait a minute…. half, half of the
    crimes of mur– ..half of the murders in this country are committed
    by black people even though black people are 12% of the population,
    which means 6% of the population are committing almost half the
    murders. 6% of the population are committing almost half the murders.
    And you throw out the old people and the young people Piers, you’re
    talking about 3% of the population committing almost half the murders
    … this is why commonsensical people PROFILE!”

    I
    converted it to the following, using Find & Replace:

    “Almost
    20 instances of quoting white separatist pseudo-statistics as if they
    were fact over the last 5 weeks Piers, … by On Point commenters
    from North Carolina..” ………….. “There’s almost 20
    instances of white separatist pseudo-statistics being quoted as if
    they were fact over the last 5 weeks. All – wait, wait a minute….
    all, all of the quoting of pseu– ..all of the quoting of white
    separatist pseudo-statistics as if they were fact in this On Point
    forum are done by people from North Carolina even though people from
    North Carolina are 3% of the population, which means 1.5% of the
    population are doing almost All the quoting of white separatist
    pseudo-statistics. And you throw out the old people and the young
    people Piers, you’re talking about less than 0.75% of the population
    doing almost All the quoting of white separatist pseudo-statistics …
    this is why commonsensical people PROFILE people from North
    Carolina!”

    This
    is how the changes above were made:

    We
    first replace “7,000 murders” with “Almost 20 instances of
    quoting white separatist pseudo-statistics as if they were fact”

    Then
    we replace “last year” with “over the last 5 weeks”

    Next
    we replace “half” with “all”

    Then
    “murders” becomes “quoting of white separatist
    pseudo-statistics as if they were fact” and then “quoting of
    white separatist pseudo-statistics”

    Then
    “crimes of mur–” became “quoting of pseu–”

    Then
    “in this country” became “in this On Point forum”

    Now
    comes the verbal sleight of hand. This was the most difficult part
    for me. As I wrote earlier, Mr. Elder used information about three
    separate groups of people – crime victims, criminal offenders, and
    a portion of the US populace, each of which has something in common
    – they’re all ”black.”

    So
    I had to find the common denominator to use. I finally landed on
    “North Carolina.”

    So
    I replaced “black people” with “people from North Carolina”

    That
    didn’t “read” exactly right, so I changed “of” to “by” to
    read “…Piers,… by people from North Carolina…”

    Then
    “committed” became “done” and “committing” became “doing”

    Then
    I found that North Carolina has about 3% of total US population, and
    so 12% became 3%, 6% became 1.5%, and 3% became 0.75%

    The
    final change was to make the first group much more specific –
    changing “Piers,… by people from North Carolina…” to
    “Piers,… by On Point commenters from North Carolina…”

    Then
    it was just edited for consistency of tense, etc. and “people from
    North Carolina” was added at the end, for emphasis and clarity.

    Thanks
    for your attention.

  • John Cedar

    I Googled “North Carolina voter id law free”
    The first hit was the Huffington post and even they had to admit the law has a free voter ID initiative.

    Which means the fees you paid were  for a drivers license not for the right to vote.
    And if you didn’t lose your chit in the first place, you would have already had a birth certificate in hand.

    • http://www.facebook.com/futo.buddy Futo Buddy

      badges? we don’t need no stinkin’ badges!

  • OnPointComments

    I have no doubt that he will.
     
    WEINER VOWS TO STICK IT OUT
    http://www.drudgereport.com/

    • hennorama

      These jokes just write themselves.

  • jefe68

    If one was to read the conservative and Republican commenters here you would think that the GOP was gaining ground. Apparently not. The GOP is at an all time low of 24 percent and falling.

  • hennorama

    ANOTHER FIND & REPLACE EXERCISE, from [hennorama]:

    Another poster has created a truly absurd “homage to the algebra of Larry Elder“

    You can read it in last week’s WITN thread. I’ll be posting a response to it as well, over yonder.

    This is what Mr. Elder actually said:

    “7,000 murders last year Piers, of black people, almost all of those were committed by black people…” …… “There’s 7,000 murders last year. Half – wait, wait a minute…. half, half of the crimes of mur– ..half of the murders in this country are committed by black people even though black people are 12% of the population, which means 6% of the population are committing almost half the murders. And you throw out the old people and the young people Piers, you’re talking about 3% of the population committing almost half the murders … this is why commonsensical people PROFILE!”

    I’ve previously chopped these words into confetti, to the consternation of some.

    Let’s look at some of Mr. Elder’s words a bit more closely:

    1. “7,000 murders last year Piers, of black people, almost all of those were committed by black people…”

    AND

    2. “There’s 7,000 murders last year. Half – wait, wait a minute…. half, half of the crimes of mur– ..half of the murders in this country are committed by black people …

    Let’s turn these around to make them more active, and to show the commonalities:

    #1. becomes “Black people committed almost all of [the] 7,000 murders of black people last year, Piers.”

    #2. becomes ”There’s 7,000 murders last year. Half – wait, wait a minute…. half, half of the crimes of mur– … Black people committed half of the murders in this country.”

    The obvious question is “Are these the same groups of victims?” In other words, do “almost all of [the] 7,000 murders of black people last year, Piers” = “half of the murders in this country”? This question becomes more difficult to answer because Mr. Elder switches back and forth between victim groups and offender groups, in sequence, thusly:

    “7,000 murders last year Piers, of black people” (victims)

    “almost all of those were committed by black people…(offenders)

    “There’s 7,000 murders last year.” (victims)

    “Half – wait, wait a minute…. half, half of the crimes of mur– .. half of the murders in this country are committed by black people” (offenders)

    BTW, this rhetorical technique is known as repetition and association. One might also call it “the old switcheroo.” Mr. Elder later turns 5,486 people into 9,417,421 Americans. More on that later.

    Let’s replace some of what Mr. Elder said with known minimum quantities. Keep in mind that

    1. Not all murders are known to law enforcement
    2. The race of all victims is not known, and
    3. The race of all offenders is not known.

    The FBI collects supplementary homicide data that provides information regarding the age, sex, and race of the murder victim and offender; the type of weapon used; the relationship of the victim to the offender; and the circumstance surrounding the incident. However, law enforcement agencies can report an offense without providing the supplemental information about that offense.

    As a result, FBI data tables will show different totals for the number of murder offenses, murder victims, and murder offenders, depending on the supplementary data received by the FBI. This would happen even if supplementary data were available for all homicides, as there is some overlap and some differences exist due to issues of multiple offenders for one victim, multiple victims for one offender, etc.

    For 2011, per FBI data tables (these are minimums):

    Number of Murders: 14,612. Please note “half of” this figure does not equal 7,000. Half = 7,306.

    Of the Victims whose race is known, 6,329 were classified as “Black”. This is 50.0% of the Victims whose race is known. Please note this figure also does not equal 7,000.

    Of Offenders whose race is known, 5,486 were classified as “Black.” This is 52.4% of Offenders whose race is known. Please note this figure also does not equal 7,000.

    Still, let’s use the minimum figures that we know about, OK? We’ll sub them in for Mr. Elder’s words.

    First, “7,000 murders of black people” changes to [6,329].

    Since we are not sure if the other instance of “7,000 murders” are the same group, we’ll leave that one alone for the time being.

    Now let’s plug in the minimum number of offenders whose race is classified as “Black” – [5,486].

    Now we’ll plug in “half of” the minimum number of murders “in this country.” – [7,306]

    This is the result:

    “[6,329] murders last year Piers, of black people, almost all of those were committed by [5,486] black people…” ……. “There’s 7,000 murders last year. [7,306] – wait, wait a minute…. [7,306], [7,306] of the crimes of mur– ..[7,306] of the murders in this country are committed by [5,486] black people even though black people are 12% of the population, which means 6% of the population are committing almost half the murders. And you throw out the old people and the young people Piers, you’re talking about 3% of the population committing almost half the murders … this is why commonsensical people PROFILE!”

    Really?

    Besides the question above, about the “7,000 murders,” how did Mr. Elder jump from “…even though black people are 12% of the population, WHICH MEANS 6% of the
    population are committing almost half the murders.”?
    (emphasis added)

    I presume he eliminated females, as the vast majority of the murders whose sex is know are male. There’s some disagreement about this presumption.

    Mr. Elder’s final sentence above, “And you throw out the old people and the young people Piers, you’re talking about 3% of the population committing almost half the murders … this is why commonsensical people PROFILE!” is also problematic.

    In fact, it’s MAGIC MATH!

    “3% of the population” is an estimated 9,417,421 Americans, using the 2012 Census estimate (Total US pop = 313,914,040)

    Mr. Elder therefore said “you’re talking about [9,417,421 Americans] committing almost half the murders …

    If that was true, we should all be very, very afraid.

    The problem is, Mr. Elder was “talking about” a figure of 5,486 (minimum for 2011) black offenders “committing almost half the murders …”

    Pretty close, right?. I mean, Mr. Elder was only off by a factor of 1,716 (or so). No biggie.

    What a load of nonsense, AKA “painting with a broad brush” and “guilt by association.”

  • HonestDebate1

    Here’s something I thought I’d never say: Kudos to CNN’s Don Lemon. Bill O’Reilly  raised some hackles with his talking points memo last week but he was dead on. Someone posted the most excellent remarks, I think it was OPC. Now Mr. Lemon has endorsed the honest debate on race. Bravo.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/07/27/black-cnn-host-supports-bill-oreillys-race-comments-blames-hip-hop-culture-then-gets-criticized-for-position-by-white-guest/

    • John Cedar

      I think O’reilly doesn’t see the forest through the trees on this one.

      I recall as a kid hearing Johnny cash or C. W. McCall singing the original rap about being outlaws. Shooting a man in Reno just to watch him die. Wishing lord that I was stoned. Crashing the gate doing ninety eight. Stealing a car in his lunchbox and cutting off a piece of his dads ear.

      Throughout history there has always been lots of mothers raising kids alone, as fathers left to earn a living or to fight a war. Out of wedlock is a driver of poverty not the driver of behavior problems that the black comunity is plagued with.

      What we have today in the black community is more about liberalism. Anything goes mentality. No rules. Nothing required from kids or adults. Where getting kicked out of schoool for pot is no problem. Where having burglar tools is no problem. Where attempting to kill a neighborhood watch guy that aproches you is no problem. Where not reading cursive is no problem. Where saying, “that’s retarded sir” in court is no problem. Where the drug problem is seen as discrimination in passing laws and enforcing laws, rather than for what it is. Where stealing is seen as the natural behavior of people who don’t have a lot of money.

  • davecm

    Finally, when you thought there was hope for the liberals and Democrats to place blame for something one of them has done, once again to no surprize they will not.
    One of there own, Weiner showing off his weiner is given the old Democratic pass by a caller.
    In short, as with Clinton, they use the same old excuse, as long as they give us all the free goodies and make someone else pay for it, we do not care what kind of private life they carry on.
    The lady stated that Weiner’s mistakes were no where as BAD as that republican’s, do I see a double standard?
    I also loved Monday’s program!!!! The liberal media, Onpoint included, managed to place the blame for Trayvon’s killing on a WHITE MAN!!!
    Only in America can a brown man shoot a black man and the white man gets blamed for it.
    I forgot, we are starting another election cycle in 2014, got to get all onboard against the old WHITE republican party.
    I hope you people are proud of yourselves for what you are doing, your racial agenda has placed me a white man serving in a majority black county in harms way.
    By the way, 90% of the black people killed in America is black/black killings!   

     

    • hennorama

      davecm
      – please don’t take this the wrong way, as it’s not intended as
      criticism – I always enjoy your enthusiastic punctuation.

      There’s
      no shortage of Democrats calling for Mr. Weiner to shrink back to
      relatively small size and anonymity. And to equate one caller
      (“Janet,” who did not identify her politics) with “the liberals
      and Democrats” is unfair. Note also that the caller said “it’s
      not like he did what Eliot Spitzer (a Democrat) did …” She did
      not mention ANY Republicans. (Listen starting from 30:29 to 32:18 of
      the broadcast, above)

      Also,
      FYI, the Sanford police report described Mr. Zimmerman’s R/S
      (Race/Sex) as W(hite)/M(ale). Mr. Zimmerman’s appearance is not that
      of “a brown man.” Identifying Mr. Zimmerman as “a WHITE
      MAN!!!” began there, on an official form.

      See:

      http://www.scribd.com/doc/86400326/trayvon-martin-police-report
      (near the bottom of page 6)

      I’m
      sorry that you feel that you are “in harms way.” If you’re
      afraid of being murdered, you should be most afraid of other white
      males, as FBI data for 2011 indicates that in Single victim/single
      offender situations (and based on limited data) nearly 83% of White
      Victims had a White Offender. (For the 3,172 Single victim/single
      offender circumstances with White Victims, 2,630 Offenders were White
      (82.9%) ).

      Let
      me start by saying that FBI data is limited, and one should keep in
      mind that (think of Donald Rumsfeld’s phrase “known unknowns”):

      1.
      Not all murders are known to law enforcement

      2.
      The race of all victims is not known, and

      3.
      The race of all offenders is not known.

      The
      FBI collects supplementary homicide data that provides information
      regarding the age, sex, and race of the murder victim and offender;
      the type of weapon used; the relationship of the victim to the
      offender; and the circumstance surrounding the incident. However,
      Law enforcement agencies can report an offense without providing the
      supplemental information about that offense.

      As
      a result, there will be different totals for the number of murder
      offenses, murder victims, and murder offenders, depending on the
      supplementary data received by the FBI. This would happen even if
      supplementary data were available for all homicides, as there is some
      overlap and some differences exist due to issues of multiple
      offenders for one victim, multiple victims for one offender, etc.

      That
      said, let’s look at a very small and narrow cohort of victims and
      offenders, from FBI supplemental data in “Expanded Homicide Data
      Table 6, Murder, Race and Sex of Victim by Race and Sex of Offender,
      2011

      [Single
      victim/single offender]

      These
      are much smaller cohorts of Victims, Offenders, and Situations
      (Single victim/single offender), so considerable care must be used
      when interpreting this information.

      Repeating
      - considerable care must be used when interpreting this information.

      FYI,
      for 2011 “Single victim/single offender situations accounted for
      48.4 percent of all murders for which the UCR Program received
      supplemental data.“ This was the most common known Victim/Offender
      Situation. This also means that 51.6 percent “of all murders for
      which the UCR Program received supplemental data” were NOT [Single
      victim/single offender] situations, and/or were situations where the
      Victim/Offender Situation/relationship was Unknown.

      Here
      are a few data points from this Table:

      For
      the 3,172 Single victim/single offender circumstances with White
      Victims, 2,630 Offenders were White (82.9%), 448 were Black (14.1%),
      33 were Other (1.0%), and 61 were of Unknown race (1.9%).

      For
      the 2,695 Single victim/single offender circumstances with Black
      Victims, 2,447 Offenders were Black (90.8%), 193 were White (7.2%), 9
      were Other (0.3%), and 46 were of Unknown race (1.7%).

      This
      is where your “By the way, 90% of the black people killed in
      America is black/black killings!” likely comes from – “Expanded
      Homicide Data Table 6, Murder, Race and Sex of Victim by Race and Sex
      of Offender, 2011

      [Single
      victim/single offender]

      This
      is not at all surprising, as the vast majority of violent crimes are
      INTRAracial.

      See:

      http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-6

      and
      also

      http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-4

      • HonestDebate1
        • hennorama

          1 Hot Dense Beat – I’ve posted multiple replies to your original post, each of which has been auto-moderated.

          As none of my auto-moderated posts have yet appeared, I’ll try this truncated response instead.

          Your absurd “homage” in the linked post above provokes some obvious questions:

          1. What happened to the other “6 yellow people [who] ate 3500 red apples”?

          2. Since Mr. Elder said this at the start of his interview –

          “7,000 murders, last year Pierce, of black people, almost all of those were committed by black people …,” and quickly followed that with “There’s 7,000 murders last year. Half – wait, wait a minute…. half, half of the crimes of mur– ..half of the murders in this country are committed by black people…”

          wouldn’t “This [have] meant 12 yellow people got “7,000 apples … almost all of [which are yellow]?”

          Nice try, but seriously – keep your day job AND your night job.

          ==========

          Allow me to help, if I may. We’re going to play “Find & Replace” with your absurd “homage.”

          This is really easy. Anyone can play along. Just copy the “homage” from the linked post above into your word processing application, then -

          Find “apple” and Replace with murder (“If Apples were murders”)
          Find “farmers” and Replace with producers
          Find “grew” and Replace with produced
          Find “yellow people” and replace with black people
          Find “red people” and replace with white (and other) people
          Find “eat/ate” and their derivations and Replace with commit/committed and their derivations

          Lastly, Find and delete the red herrings – “despite the sacrifice to their budget, “ and “pulled off the market and “

          Here’s the result, which I’ve dubbed

          “When North Carolina musician/farmers try to reason, you get murdersauce.”

          “Once upon a time in a land where everything was a color in the rainbow, there was a community of murder producers. They were 100 strong if you counted everyone. Revenue from the sale of murders sustained their needs. Murders were the life of the community. They produced red murders and yellow murders, every murder was precious. The yellow and red murders both brought the same price at market. They both had equal potential to sell well. The color made no difference to the buyer who was far more concerned with the general character of the murder. Some had deficiencies and some did not; some stood out… big time… both ways… both colors.

          “It was decided 14,000 murders (half red and half yellow) would be committed. To ensure equality, the murders to be committed were divided evenly, 7000 each, between the white (and other) people and the black people. The community consisted of 12 black people and 88 white (and other) people. This meant 12 black people got 3500 red murders and 3500 yellow murders; and 88 white (and other) people got 3500 red murders and 3500 yellow murders.

          “There was much concern over white (and other) people committing yellow murders, the yellow murders were the topic of discussion. Some were angry that 12 people got 7000 murders but the real concern was with half (not all) of the murders, the yellow ones. 6 black people committed 3500 red murders and 6 black people committed 3500 yellow murders. In other words, 6% of the community’s population committed 50% of the yellow murders.

          “Of the 6 black people 2 were infants who did not have teeth yet, they couldn’t commit murders. 1 was very old and also didn’t have teeth to commit a murder with. This meant 3 black people committed half of the 7000 yellow murders.”

          Voila!

          Murdersauce.

          • HonestDebate1

            Try reading it again. Mr. Elder’s algebra is impeccable. The light will eventually come on for you.

          • hennorama

            1 Hot Dense Beat – please enlighten the world by presenting the equations for Mr. Elder’s “impeccable algebra.”

          • HonestDebate1

            I can’t believe you’re still clinging to this farce.

            A disproportionately large amount of murders are committed by a demographic that represents disproportionately small
            percentage of the population. The propaganda in the wake of the Trayvon Martin tragedy is in full swing and it’s
            useless. It’s divisive. It’s awful, why are you so invested in discrediting and suppressing the truth? How can we ever get it fixed by ignoring the truth?

            “Half of the murders in this country are committed by black people, even though black people are 12 percent of the population, which means 6 percent of the population is committing almost half the murders,” Elder said. “And you throw out the old people and the young people, Piers, you’re talking about 3 percent of the population committing almost 50 percent of the murders. … This is why people profile.”

            If X = half the murders (Mr. Elder’s claim) then 2X = all the murders

            B = those murders committed by blacks

            E = those murders committed by everyone else

            They are split evenly despite population therefore:

            B = E consequently if X = B then X = E

            2X = B + E or X = B/2 + E/2

            If blacks are 12% of the population then half the murders (X) are committed by half the 12 %. That’s how 12% becomes 6%. I think you said (I won’t look it up), “not on this Earth”. You can argue the margins, is it 12% or 15%, is it half or 7/16th’s, but the algebra is impeccable.

          • hennorama

            1Bonehead Test – Again, keep your day job AND your night job.

            Rather than point out the obvious flaws in your delusional logic and your “homage” again, I’ll simply paraphrase a question from Megyn Kelly to Karl Rove, on Election Night 2012 –

            ”Is this just math that you do as a musician/farmer from North Carolina, who quotes white separatist pseudo-statistics, to make yourself feel better, or do you believe this is real?”

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/JXSANCUDPIKQSPID5KT2U4XK5Y TF

      Weiner was the “left’s one shining hope”?

      Weiner gave great lip–always something liberals never are allowed to do on TV in great numbers–but really didn’t have a lot of success as a legislator with his name on it. He didn’t have an agency, a cause, a touchstone of accomplishment.

      The funny thing is how predictable it is to hear a right-winger say of one of the few outspoken liberals who gets on TV on a regular basis used to be “the great hope”.

    • jefe68

      The diatribe by the regressive right winger full of typical race baiting memes.

ONPOINT
TODAY
Sep 16, 2014
Jasmin Torres helps classmate Brianna Rameles with a worksheet at the Diloreto Magnet School in New Britain, Conn., Wednesday Feb. 22, 2012. (AP/Charles Krupa)

More parents are “red-shirting” their children in kindergarten—holding them back for a year, hoping they’ll have an edge. Does it work? We look.

Sep 16, 2014
From "Rich Hill"

“Rich Hill,” a new documentary on growing up poor, now, in rural America. The dreams and the desperation.

RECENT
SHOWS
Sep 15, 2014
This Monday, Sept. 27, 2010 file photo shows hikers on the South Kaibab Trail in Grand Canyon National Park, Ariz. (AP/Carson Walker)

Uproar over development plans for the Grand Canyon. We go to the Navajo Nation and the Canyon floor to see what’s at stake.

 
Sep 15, 2014
In this Thursday, Sep. 11, 2014 photo, Middle Eastern leaders stand together during a family photo with of the Gulf Cooperation Council and regional partners at King Abdulaziz International Airport’s Royal Terminal in Jiddah, Saudi Arabia. (AP/Brendan Smialowski, Pool)

President Obama says he will build a coalition of partners in the Middle East to combat ISIS. We’ll do a reality check on who’s really stepping up for what.

On Point Blog
On Point Blog
Our Week In The Web: September 12, 2014
Friday, Sep 12, 2014

In which you had varied reactions to the prospect of a robotic spouse.

More »
Comment
 
Beverly Gooden on #WhyIStayed
Friday, Sep 12, 2014

Beverly Gooden — who originated the #WhyIStayed hashtag that has taken off across Twitter — joined us today for our discussion on domestic violence.

More »
1 Comment
 
Tierney Sutton Plays LIVE For On Point
Friday, Sep 5, 2014

We break out Tierney Sutton’s three beautiful live tracks from our broadcast today for your listening pleasure.

More »
2 Comments