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A War On Voting?

The big push to tighten voting laws across the country, and its politics. Charges of a war on voting.

Don Huntrods, of Van Meter, Iowa, emerges from a voting booth after casting his ballot, in Lee Township, Iowa, Tuesday, Nov. 2, 2004. (AP)

Don Huntrods, of Van Meter, Iowa, emerges from a voting booth after casting his ballot, in Lee Township, Iowa, Tuesday, Nov. 2, 2004. (AP)

Democracy means get out the vote. But a new wave of state legislation across the country is making it harder to vote. Tightening up in many ways. Making voter registration more difficult. Reducing early voting days. Demanding voter ID. Proof of citizenship.

Backers say it’s all to clean up American voting. Critics say that’s a ruse. That voter fraud problems in this country are miniscule. That it’s really a Republican drive to push away voters they don’t want at the polls. A “war on voting.”

This hour On Point: the wave of new restrictions on American voting.

-Tom Ashbrook

Guests

Ari Berman, a contributing writer for The Nation and author of Herding Donkeys: The Fight to Rebuild the Democratic Party and Reshape American Politics. His article, for the September 15th issue of Rolling Stone, was The GOP War on Voting.

Jason Torchinsky, Partner at the private lawfirm Holtzman Vogel. Former Counsel to the Civil Rights Division at the U.S. Department of Justice; Deputy general counsel to the 2004 Bush-Cheney campaign and Inaugural Committee.

Elisabeth MacNamara, National president of the League of Women Voters.

Jamin Raskin, Democratic State Senator from Maryland, he’s author of “Overruling Democracy: The Supreme Court versus the American People.”

Highlights

A series of laws passed by Republican-controlled state houses nationwide has critics warning of a “war on voting” waged by the GOP to disenfranchise poor and minority voters who skew Democratic. Supporters of the new laws say that it is about preserving the integrity of the process and rooting out voter fraud.

One of the most high-profile changes to voting laws have been passed in six states recently, requiring a photo ID to vote. Nationwide, ten percent of Americans don’t have a photo ID, including 25 percent of African Americans.

“We definitely view it as voter suppression, whatever the motivation,” said Elisabeth MacNamara, national president of the non-partisan League of Women Voters. She said that the new laws are not only expensive to implement, but also amount to new and onerous government regulations with “almost no benefit from an integrity standpoint.”

“It is sweeping, it amounts to the most wholesale rewriting of the nation’s election laws since the passage of the Voting Rights Act,” Ari Berman, a contributing writer for The Nation, whose recent article in Rolling Stone dealt with the new voting laws.

“There’s no problem in American elections that justifies these types of laws.”

Not so, supporters of the laws contend. “What you’re seeing is an effort to help ensure the integrity of elections nationwide,” said Jason Torchinsky, a partner at the private law firm Holtzman Vogel. He’s the former Counsel to the Civil Rights Division at the U.S. Department of Justice; during the Bush administration. “I don’t think these efforts at the state level are designed to stop Democrats from voting.”

Critics say concerns about voters’ identities are unfounded. “There are a miniscule number of cases where people have impersonated someone to go and vote – you have a better chance of being struck by lightning,” argued Jamin Raskin, Democratic State Senator from Maryland and author of “Overruling Democracy: The Supreme Court versus the American People.”

From Tom’s Reading List

Rolling Stone “As the nation gears up for the 2012 presidential election, Republican officials have launched an unprecedented, centrally coordinated campaign to suppress the elements of the Democratic vote that elected Barack Obama in 2008. Just as Dixiecrats once used poll taxes and literacy tests to bar black Southerners from voting, a new crop of GOP governors and state legislators has passed a series of seemingly disconnected measures that could prevent millions of students, minorities, immigrants, ex-convicts and the elderly from casting ballots. “What has happened this year is the most significant setback to voting rights in this country in a century,” says Judith Browne-Dianis, who monitors barriers to voting as co-director of the Advancement Project, a civil rights organization based in Washington, D.C.”

Talking Points Memo “Sen. Dick Durbin (D-IL) will chair a hearing next week examining the rash of voter ID laws passed by state legislatures this year amidst concerns that such laws could suppress Democratic turnout across the country.”

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  • Hidan

    Gotta stop mickey mouse from voting by taking away the rights of 100k+ mostly black and Latinos.

    Good Old Republican Party motto’s,

    “Where denying  minorities the right to vote isn’t a job but a hobby”

    or

    “we’ll put the Jim Crow back in voting”

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    Voter ID is primarily a solution in search of a problem, but it is a valid solution to a potential problem.

    A more important matter is what to do about the many people who vote without a clue as to what they’re supporting or why.

    • http://www.richardsnotes.org Richard

      Amen.

    • Jeffe68

      Well that’s their right. You can lead a horse to water as they say.

    • Hidan

      Valid solution to a potential problem? As evidence have suggested, such prevents far more people and greater # from exercising their right to vote than it prevents people who aren’t legally allow to.

      These same republicans who “Want to prevent potential problems” don’t seem to mind when it’s in about the prison system, healthcare, wars, health care of returning Vets, our lopsided and failing foreign policy, Citizen United, support for despots, Outsourcing, failing infrastructural, failure to pay down the debt,war on drugs and so many others. 

      Feel free to prove that the method republicans are using to fix a “Potential Problem” of voter fraud is not/would not have a adverse effect on legal voters being disenfranchised and would effect their political rivals to a larger extent.

  • Michiganjf

    When you can’t win a majority of voters fair and square, find ways to cheat Americans out of their vote.

    Cheating, outright lying and fabrication, misleading and mischaracterization… all these come so easily to Republicans, while the self-serving Frat boys who lead the party have convinced the sheep that integrity and truth don’t matter, nor does what’s good or bad for America… instead, all that matters is that our side wins!

  • Winston Smith

    We require people to show their driver’s license when stopped by a police officer.  We require people to show valid identification when crossing the border into Canada, to cross back into the U.S., etc.  We require (or at least responsible merchants do) id to verify that the person using a particular credit card in the person named on the card.  Medical providers require that a medical card be shown in order to receive non-emergency service.  So requiring people to verify their identification prior to voting is not racist or political, it is simply a means of preventing fraud.  If someone is unwilling to show some form of id (whether it be a driver’s license, birth certificate, ,etc.), then they must have something to hide. States that require some form of photo id must be willing to create another document other than a driver’s license or accept an existing document such as a birth certificate so as to avoid preventing a legitimate citizen from being able to vote.  But as long as they take that step, I believe that requiring voter id is a valid way to insure that the person attempting to vote is a legitimate U.S. citizen.  Where I am from, you simply give them your name without any id.  Since my son is at college, I could go in in the morning under my name and then go in later in the day using his name, an illegal act, and vote twice.  Voter id prevents this and other types of fraud.

    • Cory

      All of your talking points are in order.  Answer a few questions please… 
      1.  What plitical party benefits most from these restrictions?
      2.  Why is this party so intersted in these changes NOW?

      • Anonymous

        Having spent a good deal of my life in places where one had to carry personal identification at all times (nice places! democracies!), I’m not particular sympathetic with the hard and fast refusal of some Americans to do so. At the same time, it seems obvious that we should first phase in an identity card of some kind and then — later — phase in the requirement at the polls. 

        The fact that Republicans want to instantly — this election! — require identification at the voting booth gives away their true intent. So lets “compromise” on this:  let’s give the phase-in of an ID card a decade with plenty of outreach to people who don’t normally get help with bureaucracies.  Then let’s talk about phasing in the requirement at the polls over another five years. And let’s make it a really smart card that can be renewed or replaced easily.

      • Phil Ronco

        in answer to your questions, the political party(ies) that only want the actual person who has registered to vote benefits by having an honest democracy.  Regardless of when it is happening, it is the right thing to do.  I’m sure that it has been suggested many times in the past with the same wrong headed Democratic race bating cries echoed before.

    • Jeffe68

      First off it’s not a right to drive. Do get that? Second, voter fraud is extremely rare and not the real reason the Republicans are changing the laws. Interesting to note that it’s only Republican governors and legislators that are doing this. My proof of residency is my proof of me being able to vote, period. If I’m a resident of Boston, I have to register to vote. Then I can vote.

      http://www.brennancenter.org/content/resource/policy_brief_on_the_truth_about_voter_fraud/

      http://www.truthaboutfraud.org/documents/investigators_guide.html

      • Phil Ronco

        In terms of only Republicans advocating for this, Mayor Daley would not have  been able to stuff the ballot boxes with the votes of non-existent or dead people and so of course he would be against it.  The same people who advocate “statistical sampling” rather than actual counting of heads during a census in order to play games with the demographics and aid in gerrymandering for their cause would probably be against it as well.

    • Anonymous

      The difference is one of rights (vote) versus privilege (driver’s license).

  • Winston Smith

    A follow up to my previous post.  The allegation has been made that “requiring voter id is a solution in search of a problem.”  Well, isn’t it more rational to prevent a problem from happening in the first place?  If Congress (particularly the Democrats) had had the guts to address the issue of illegal immigration before it became a 12 million person problem that it now is, it would have been much easier to solve and would have prevented the mammoth problem that we now have.  “A stitch in time saves nine” applies to this issue.

    • Cory

      Why not put on your winter parka in July?  You know with certainty that in the future it will be cold and without your parka you’d be really uncomfortable.  Put your parka on now so you won’t have to worry about the possibility of forgetting later.  Don’t forget your mittens!

      • Phil Ronco

        A rather nonsensical reply to a legitimately raised issue.  But then, when correct logic argues against your point, this is the type of dribble that one must apparently resort to.

    • Anonymous

      So you advocate government regulation of anything that might cause a problem at some point?  I never would have guessed.

  • Yar

    Kentucky is one of only a handful of states that take away voting rights from all former felons unless they can get a pardon from the governor (Virginia is the other one).http://www.kftc.org/our-work/restoration

    Elections boil down to money and math, where the parties wage war on the people using polling and statistics to direct campaign dollars in an divide and win strategy.  Money is raised through polarization of issues, and spent to further polarize the electorate. 
    Each election cycle our nation get less governable, how do we return to civility, and democratic representation?

    I want to see candidates who will run on the promise not to take any campaign money while in office.  No PAC money, no campaign committee, and will promise to work to end the unlimited spending by corporations allowed by the citizen’s united court decision.  

    I believe using social media, grassroots organizing, voter education, and volunteer recruitment we can restore our democracy.  

    The question to ask single issue voters:
    Why did your issue become so polarized?  Are your leaders using you to divide this country. Are you being played by your leadership? 
    When it becomes an us against them game, everyone loses.

  • Zing

    Yet another indication that the left sees their little White House adventure coming to a close.  I suppose it never hurts to have a backup plan, but the problem of a weak leader and a failed presidency should take care of itself.  The base that elected Obama is largely out of work, still has no healthcare insurance, and has seen the administration morph into a third Bush term.  The President has turned to golf (stay the course) and the left has directed their flailing useless camping trips to the city. I wish it were otherwise.  

    • Cory

      Because democrats could never win an election without voter fraud, and such fraud is only committed in the name of democrats.  Give yourself a gold conservative star for remembering to repeat the phrase “failed Obama presidency”.  All you conservatives have to take a drink now!

      PS-  the golf think is really getting tired, and never was effective as a “gotcha”, FYI.

    • mary elizabeth

      Obama’s “failed Presidency”  is  head and shoulders above what any Republican has to offer.    Repubs have contributed not one single thing to the country’s  betterment in decades.  They have lowered the common denominator for statesmanship   as they become loyal syncophants for the  Ayn Randian  warped world view.

    • TFRX

      You were funnier and more cogent when you limited yourself to one sentence at a shot.

      Not that you were funny or cogent, just funnier and more cogent.

      • Zing

        Sorry I hit a nerve.

  • Cory

    Nothing more than a conservative ploy to try to stave off the inevitability of changing demographics and hold on to relevancy for a little longer than they otherwise would.  Shouldn’t we be suspicious when a party in power tries to change election rules to benefit themselves or harm their rivals?

    In Wisconsin, Governor Scott Walker has abolished collective bargaining for public employee unions.  He has also ended payroll deductions for public unions, effectively destroying them.  As a result, many recall efforts have sprung up across the state.  The Republican response to the wave of recalls?  That they are too expensive, and too easy to start.  So, the republicans in the state are trying to pass legislation to try to make recalls of public officals more difficult to do.

    Partisanship and corruption bordering on evil.  I challenge anyone to deny the nature of these actions. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

    The most intelligent people I know do not vote.   The do-you-vote question to the well-educated is typically met with a cynical denial. 

    They realize voting is rigged scam where money, lobbies, campaign funds and media bias select the so-called leaders who serve the interests of the elites. On top of that, manipulation of the voting districts and eligibility continues.

    Voting is for typically uninformed, insulated people and the elderly.  To subject oneself to such a ruse, is an insult to one’s own intelligence.  And the enlistment of Hollywood personalities to extol the patriotic virtues of voting only increases the cynicism and distrust of a corrupt and flawed system.

    • http://www.richardsnotes.org Richard

      “The most intelligent people I know do not vote.”

      Gotta get out more and make more friends to raise that IQ pool…

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

        My point being that those who vote have lower IQs. 
        I dare anyone to conduct such a survey. 
        I talk to plenty of people, of varied backgrounds (unskilled laborers to Phds), and I have definitively arrived at this conclusion. 

        BTW  Richard,  It takes a higher IQ to discern another’s intelligence.  I believe it is you that is lacking the fundamental requisite for such inquiry.

        • Jeffe68

          It’s great to see such large minds at work in the morning.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Evidently, small minds as well.

          • Beckycarr100

            Takes one to know one.

          • Ellen Dibble

            It would be interesting to have a discussion of different levels and kinds of intelligence learning to get a sense of each other’s weaknesses and strengths.  I’m not talking just IQ; we know there are all sorts of mental approaches and skills that vary tremendously.  As I recall, when I was a child, and the same 50 children were in class with me for six years straight, I never experienced the sense of dislocation that I can feel when outsize minds, honed in awesome ways come along.  It takes a while to learn where I fit into the conversation, so to speak.  Perhaps my brain is different enough by now that almost every encounter requires that careful calibration; of personality, of reasoning, memory, etc.   Could it be that children do this automatically, because they don’t have categories to put people into, the in’s and the out’s?  That sort of thing?  Those who vote and those who don’t (don’t admit to it…)?

        • http://www.richardsnotes.org Richard

          ” It takes a higher IQ to discern another’s intelligence.”

          Where are you getting this stuff, it’s amazing.

          “I believe it is you that is lacking the fundamental requisite for such inquiry.

          The correct usage is:

          “I believe it is you WHO is lacking the fundamental requisite for such inquiry.

          People get a “who.”
          ;)

          Peace brother.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Richard,  Evidently you can attack my grammar, but not my logic. 

            How pathetic.

          • http://www.richardsnotes.org Richard

            “Evidently you can attack my grammar, but not my logic.”

            No comma needed between “grammar” and “but”.

            Punctuation too.

            Your logic is flawed in this way:

            You assume that your friends are a big enough sample to allow you to make a general statement about intelligence and voting. You don’t state how many friends you sampled (how big the pool is), where you live, how you chose the friends to sample, etc.

            The other flaw in your logic is that you seem to assume that a high raw intelligence or IQ (its debatable whether there is such a thing) is the only measure of importance when looking at the question at hand: to vote or not to vote.

            There is a marked difference between “intelligence” as you’ve defined it (IQ) and wisdom.

            Wisdom usually comes from experience. Time seems to give many of us more experiences. So, back to one of your original statements:

            “Voting is for typically uninformed, insulated people and the elderly.”

            I don’t agree with the “uninformed” or “insulated” but one of the many reasons older folks vote is because they have more experience and possibly a bit more wisdom than their younger counterparts.

            I’m proud to include myself in that category.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Hey Rich,  I agree with you on the elderly have more wisdom.   But not all.   UNnfortunately, stupid and  ignorant young people make stupid and ignorant old people.

            I do know and respect some very old and wise people…. and they do not vote.  They are not down at the old age home getting the free campaign lunch and the slap on the back by a political hack.

            The really wise elderly see right through the scam of so-called representative democracy.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            I’m shocked to agree with Paolo Caruso here, but that comman before but is appropriate.  It goes with a contrasting idea.  Yes, modernists are permitting writers to omit it, but I insist on keeping it.

          • http://www.richardsnotes.org Richard

            Greg Camp: Hey, I’m just a dumb, demented old person who votes, don’t hold me to any grammatical standards.

            My point (maybe poorly delivered) was that Paolo waded into the thicket of using intelligence as a barometer of rights and wrongs and while literacy and language skills don’t always coincide with intelligence (or wisdom), people who toss those kinds of stones ought to be doing so from a very secure house.

            I don’t claim intelligence or literacy and my wife has told me more than once that I’d be better off just leaving all commas out of my writing. Remember, I’m old and senile and I vote!

          • Robert Pierce

            Actually it’s “I believe it is you who ARE lacking the fundamental requisite for such inquiry.”

        • Beckycarr100

          You are so full of it! If you’re so smart you should know that “I talk to a lot of people” doesn’t constitute scientific proof; it’s just anecdotal. I know a lot of very smart people who vote and I know a lot of uninformed people vote, but what does that prove? Your comment about Richard’s intelligence is uncalled for.

    • Beckycarr100

      Sometimes (ok, a lot of times, you vote for the lesser of the evils), but if the greater of the evils gets in, there are real consequences. Do you think Al Gore would have invaded Iraq? I don’t. Would he have appointed John Roberts to the Supreme Court? Never!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    I will never vote. I’m sorry America.

    • Cory

      Need more.

    • Jeffe68

      In my view if you don’t vote, which is your right, you also don’t have much of a leg to stand on in terms of political discussion.  

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

        What are you saying Jeffe68 ????  Are you serious with this empty patriotic jingo?   

        The people I know that do not vote are the most intelligent and politically enlightened, who will readily engage in intense debate, if not an endless diatribe of facts and logic. 

        Those who religiously vote, avoid political discussion due to lack of information or interest.  At best they have a superficial understanding of the issues.  

        • Hidan

          In my experience it’s the independents that are often the most uninformed voters these people often take very little time to research what the canidate is saying or has done. Instead with the help of the media and the “Some people say” rely on sound bites to pick who they are voting for.

          CNN loves to promote these people

        • mary elizabeth

          I guess we know different type of people.  My experience is the opposite of yours.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Maybe you over-estimate your friends.

          • TFRX

            Yep. If one doesn’t vote, what right does one have to complain?

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Why does one have to engage in useless voting to complain about Lobbyists, PACS, Corporate campaigns, and biased media???

          • Jmc

            it is useless because the majority of the population stays home and complains on message boards.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Explain to me how money changes an election.  I vote, and no one buys that vote.  I read the arguments and make my own decision.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            You’re kidding right?    Ask yourself (put on your thinking cap Greg), “why did Obama need over 500 million in campaign funds, especially from Goldman Sachs?” 

            Money compromises politicians.  They do not serve you,  they serve the bankers and corporations that support them. 

          • Beckycarr100

            Money buys air time so candidates can sell their slickly packaged lies and half-truths. Too many people will believe it without verification. Look at how many people bought the birther and death panel nonsense. It would be great if we all thad the motivation and resources and savvy to check the veracity of all the propaganda, but it just isn’t so. Sometimes the message that gets heard the most sinks in whether it’s true or not.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Explain to me how money changes an election.  I vote, and no one buys that vote.  I read the arguments and make my own decision.

          • TFRX

            If one considers this place a “left wing” forum (a big if), I want to know if you go to right wing sites, and what kind of reception you get for your “Even after you get into the booth it’s all the same” schtick.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Why does one have to engage in useless voting to complain about Lobbyists, PACS, Corporate campaigns, and biased media???

        • Beckycarr100

          What are you saying – only uninformed people vote and enlightened, informed people don’t vote? That’s a crock of brown stuff.

      • Anonymous

        What if you are prevented from voting, or are intimidated to not vote, or to vote in a particular way?

        Neil

  • Anonymous

    On what familiy moral value does the Republican Party stand on today to systematically supress the rights of the people to vote? How do any Christians reconcile supporting this kind of behavior?… supression of the vast hoards of minions of the devil? WWJD? :^)

  • Worried for the country(MA)

    Who could be against fair, fraud-free elections?

    • Anonymous

      Elections can be affected before the voting happens, as well as during and after.

      Neil

    • Ellen Dibble

      Laughing — no.  Shocked.  When did you fall off the turnip truck?

    • TFRX

      Also laughing. TV-quality spit-take.

      Where’s the fraud? (And, no, Fox and Rush and such don’t count as evidence.)

      • Modavations

        But Herr Feidman and Kruger are?????Rush and Drudge have huge investigative organizations.Watch Wash.Journal,TV without bias.

        • TFRX

          Your meds are off. Try different levels of the opiate you say you love so much.

    • Winston Smith

      Apparently, Democrats

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    Because what is the use of arguing with me if I don’t vote. what is the use of listening to me if that cast my vote.
     
    I have political views for the Democratic and the Republicans parties. I listen to both parties but still divided when it comes to election day.
     
    Reluctant to vote the blue or red. Reluctant to vote the right party or not, anguish to vote the right man or woman for the white house and the guilt if I voted the wrong person.
     
    We Americans has been subject to vote but have you ever think if we didn’t vote or the less we vote that we have more freedom.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      Some people feel their vote won’t count so they say ‘Why vote’? Students and employees report they are too busy to take time off from work or school. Some Americans are not interested in voting or politics. People who are ill or disabled can’t get to the polls. Illegal immigrants are not authorized to vote. Many non-voters say they just don’t like the candidates. Some residents don’t have transportation to get to the polls. Citizens might be out of town on vacation or business trips. Forgetting to vote is a common explanation. Many Americans complain the voting lines are too long.

      • Ellen Dibble

        I always say that I don’t really have a clue what my representatives, whom we have been electing for decades, are actually doing.  It is easy to think “people” would vote them out if there was a problem.  But “they” seem unwilling to set forth what they are actually doing on the job.  In my job, I am eager to let it be known what I am doing and why, and how; what might make the path more direct, less bumpy; what others are helping along the way; where the forks in the road seem to be.  All that.  I want that out there if anyone cares.
            As voters, don’t we care?  Do we want to go and badger the House staff day-in/day-out, what is being addressed today, where are the relevant people applying pressure or meeting, investigating?  No, I wait for the news outlets to let me know.  But they don’t.  So I have to wait for campaign ads, and mostly learn from the campaign ads.  Informed voting?  No.
            So failing informed voting as a possibility, there is always stating your positions with large placards, hanging out in groups in parks, trying to get the attention of the media.  Hear Us.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

    Republicans – democrats, its all just theatre.  They blatantly discuss PACS and Super Pacs and take close tally of the Campaign chests of each candidate.  That’s what counts.   

    These monied interests even choose their scoundrels (candidates) on their ability to be compromised, coerced and controlled.  Therefore, a prerequisite of a corporate candidate (party is not important) is to have skeletons in one’s closet (i.e. Clinton from Arkansas and Obama from God knows where).  Even Obama’s parentage is dubious (Google Frank Marshall Davis). 

    • Ellen Dibble

      What skeletons do you think Romney has?  This is the second time the Republicans seem to be thinking they can control him, and he already has a track record of flip-flopping, so obviously can be influenced, so to speak.  But I don’t see the skeleton in the closet.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

        Romney was already a multi-millionaire and political royalty. He did not have to be bought,  he represents corporate interests without question.

    • mary elizabeth

      Plesase explain the dubiousness of Obama’s parentage.  More has been documented about Batack Obama’s parentage then most any other political figure. 

  • Gues

    Are all of the states with new Voter ID laws providing ID cards free of charge?  If not, then this drive to prevent voter fraud amounts to a poll tax.  

    • Anonymous

      If there are other impediments like taking time off to travel to get the ID, or needing a birth certificate (many people never get these), then these laws are too onerous and should be struck down.

      Homeless people have the right to vote, too.

      Neil

    • brian parizek

      i agree…if a state is going to require a photo/id voting card, then it should be provided free of charge.

      • TFRX

        I believe in at least one state the “free” card is something you can only get at a DMV office.

        If we’re dealing with folks who don’t have licenses, what better way to make it a pain in the ass and hassle?

        • brian parizek

          different from you, i don’t see any problem w/ requiring voters to go to the dmv (or some other comparable office) and obtain the free id (save some cost, and make it good for 10years even).

          i wonder if you see voting as a pain in the ass or hassle?

          • TFRX

            I can walk 1/4 mi to my polling place.

            I’m not projecting this ease to everyone. I remember hearing about Columbus in 2004, and people having to wait hours to vote.

            That is what happens when a Secretary of State wants to keep people from voting. I believe that was Blackwell, who disgraced himself in public office on any number of scandals.

            What they are doing are putting logistical hurdles in place for people not like me. This is a feature, not a bug.

             

          • brian parizek

            perhaps a solution to those kinds of issues…open voting over a 5 or 7 day period.

          • TFRX

            …but we have state leges closing this down also.

            You do have reasonable-sounding ideas. But when the GOP is there to enact them, we end up with logistical hurdles.

            A feature, not a bug.

          • TFRX

            I can walk 1/4 mi to my polling place.

            I’m not projecting this ease to everyone. I remember hearing about Columbus in 2004, and people having to wait hours to vote.

            That is what happens when a Secretary of State wants to keep people from voting. I believe that was Blackwell, who disgraced himself in public office on any number of scandals.

            What they are doing are putting logistical hurdles in place for people not like me. This is a feature, not a bug.

             

  • Yar

    Two parties fight for office while only one party hangs on to power; “The incumbent Party”  
    I want to clean house, 435 house seats are up for election in 2012.  Let the people start the middle party and elect citizens who will agree not to take any money while in office. We can overthrow the party of incumbents.  My slogan idea for the middle party is; “Register to win.”
    Who is up for working on this campaign?

    • Ellen Dibble

      Without a candidate and a ticket, I think this party would be the party of those that do not vote, a sizable bloc.

      • Yar

        The party recruits candidates in all 435 house districts.  Building from the grassroots.  

  • Greenworks12

      There are many ways to vote. Back in the sixties college acedemics suffered due to my passionate involvement in SDS, heralding a charter for a democracy gone afoul. The same energy that Occupy Wall street has engendered reminds me of those days. Hopefully this contagion which seems to be spreading around the globe will organize itself into a force that changes the economic political climate offering up some viable candidates that actually stand for something meaningful reflecting the hopes and aspirations of the working classes.   

  • Anonymous

    I have voted in every election state and national election and almost every local election since 1980.  I am frustrated by the way our system works — or doesn’t work.  But, I wonder what this has to do with my intelligence, or lack thereof?

    I have a privilege I probably take for granted: I’m a white male.  We need to figure out how to get as many people voting as possible, and not worry about fraud so much.  Ironically, the unverifiable electronic voting machines that have been shown to be very easily broken do real damage to voter turnout *and* they allow the possibility of massive systematic election fraud.

    I wonder why it is that it seems to be the same people who are proponents of these voting machines are also proponents of voter ID?

    Also, I think it is very short sighted to prevent people who have served their prison time from voting after they return to civilian life.  Why wouldn’t we want them to be invested in a civil society?

    Neil

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

      You’re focusing on increasing the number of voters, and I am telling you, and you can see it on the protest posters, that young people will not buy into this voting system until they lobbys, campaign fundings, pacs and the biased corporate media are removed from the democratic process.  
      Even if they create laws to require mandatory voting,  you still have a country voting for corporate stooges, billionaires and corrupt clowns.

      • Anonymous

        Paolo,

        We have abysmal voter turnout in almost all elections, let alone low voter registration rates.

        This is a fact.

        A healthy democracy depends on everybody who can be registered to vote to be registered, and then hopefully 75% of the registered voters actually vote most of the time.

        We are so far from this here in the US, and this is a big problem.  So, why is it that people want to lower the number of voters taking part?

        Neil

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

          Again,  the system does not work…its rigged.  You want the cart before the horse.  But the system needs to rid,  Corporate campaign contributions, lobbyists, PACs and media bias.  Then you’ll start seeing more registered voters, and then 90% of registered voters voting.

          • Jmc

            feet cannot be bought

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Feet aren’t bought,  politicians are.

          • Jmc

            Paolo, i am willing to concede to your arguement with the condition that as long as the turnout stays at the current level, most of your arguements of fraud by the influence of money will be present although if citizens become tired of such a system and decide to turn out and vote with their collective conscience alll the money in the world will not be able to save the corrupt nature we see today, Fair?

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            THERE ARE NO CREDIBLE CANDIDATES TO VOTE FOR.   The current system only produces billionaires, corporate stooges and corrupt clowns.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Prove that the system is rigged.  Accusations are easy; proof, not so much.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Prove that the system is rigged.  Accusations are easy; proof, not so much.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Im am not the attorney general.  Why dont you prove that is not rigged.  

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            I don’t have to prove a negative.  You have to prove a positive.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Hey Greg,  go count some chads.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            Hey Greg,  go count some chads.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

            The term “PROVE IT” along with “patriotism” are the last resort of scoundrels.

          • Anonymous

            I agree that we need to get anonymous, unaccountable money out of elections.  Corporations are not people, and money is not speech.  We need public financing and only small contributions that we can know who gave them.

            We the people *own* the airwaves, so why do we have to pay to use them for the most basic function of our democracy?

            But, we cannot let perfection be the enemy of the good.  Voter participation will reduce the influence of money.  And reduced influence of money will help voter participation.  I’ve got it.  :-)

            Neil

        • Rnadeau77

          Instead of impeding voting we should be REQUIRE all citizens to vote. Remove all road blocks to interfere with voters participating in the process. Let’s bring the purple finger to the US.

    • TFRX

      …and we get to the Fox method: Voter registration fraud isn’t the same thing as voter fraud.

      Every election day Fox is duty-bound to provide War-of-the-Worlds*-like panic reporting on voting fraud and intimidation which simply doesn’t happen.

      (*And I mean the original radio version, which took advantage of people not knowing they didn’t know.

  • Jeff Joll

    The thing that angers me is that the Democratic Party doesn’t have a permanent task force to fight this never ending assault on the right to vote by the powerful conservative forces in our country. A year before every major election liberals and the media act all surprised by this attack on our right to vote as if it’s a new event. Wake up 99%!

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

      Correction, wake up 95%.  The other 5% is exploiting us.

  • Paul, Boston MA

    The Brennan Center For Justice at NYU Law School has published several studies debunking the myth of wide spread voter fraud. In the face of painfully rigorous studies like these, it’s incredible to see politicians still use this scare tactic – and even more incredible that they aren’t being drowned out by the voices of people who know better.

    Fear mongering still beats out fact, it seems.

    • Ellen Dibble

      I misread your post at first.  You mean the Brennan Center debunked the myth of widespread of voter fraud — meaning fraud perpetrated BY voters, not by the authorities UPON the voters, wherein a machine somehow “forgets” (erases?) the entire ghetto ward, or shows everybody voting for one particular candidate, for instance.

  • Bill

    Historically, this country has had many, many more incidences of valid voters being turned away or discouraged from voting than with voter fraud. You would think the more prevalent issue should be the one addressed.

  • Roland

    Good Morning Tom. Yes, Republicans are waging War on Voting. The so-called laws against illegal aliens are a front against voters favoring Democrats and Obama.

    Republican talk about voter fraud is the pot calling the kettle black, like their attack on anything Obama wants to do as “just political.”

    There is shabby media coverage of Republican voter fraud, like the recent court filing revealing that the 2004 Ohio election was hacked 

    In 2000 Republicans ignored states’ rights when mobs were brought in to threaten vote recounters, Bill Frist and John Roberts got the Supreme Court to overrnn the Florida court order for recount.

    And besides doubling the national debt in his second term from 5 to 10 trillion dollars, Bush and Republicans paved the way for Roberts, who contrived the so-called Citizens United case, which has opened the flood gates to mega-rich control of elections.

  • BG

    It seems the biggest impediment to voting these days is having real choices. Perhaps corporations and billionaires prefer republicans who openly GIVE everything away to them as opposed to democrats who SURRENDER everything to them, but from this end, it’s all the same.

    The war on voting is only a means to finishing the war on democracy. Elections only determine which corrupt party will receive the plutocratic pay-off.

    and the retribution.

  • jim

    This is the ONLY way Republicans can win… CHEAT!

    Republicans are simply repleted with deceit and false hopes.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      The world saw that in Florida.

    • Anonymous

      Making sure Voters are US citizens isn’t cheating!  It is the responsibility of our government!

      • jim

        Sure, I totally agree with you.. However, if you put a high barrier to prevent legitimate citizens from voting, then that is an infringement to the constitutional rights to vote. YOU cannot disenfranchise citizens from voting because you require them a photo ID driver license when many of these CITIZENS… (and i cap ‘cos it don’t mean it in a small… i mean it in a BIG way) have other forms of photo ID such as university student ID that are not acceptable. I mean who are we fooling ourselves… i have NOT even heard a single case of voter fraud since i came to this country 30 years back. it is quite an ingenious and slimy way from the Republican base to have a BIG government to disenfranchise voters and their rights.

      • Beckycarr100

        Photo voter ID at the polls just proves you are the person you purport to be. It doesn’t prove you are a citizen. Not having photo ID doesn’t prove you aren’t a citizen.

  • Kelly_w_rush

    I would like to think, as an idealist, that this is simply a matter of clean up.  Regardless of the reasoning on the right that this is to cut down on voter fraud, I believe I’ve seen studies that indicate that in the states that have passed voter id laws, there is little to no real issue with voter fraud.  With no evidence of widespread fraud, it leaves little real reasoning behind the push for voter id other than to disenfranchise constituencies that traditionally vote for Democratic politicians.  

  • Scott B., Jamestown NY

    There virtually no voter fraud.  In the states claiming it’s happening it’s in the single digits, or barely into the teens, and the majority were for misdemeanors like political advertising or speech too close to polling places. 

    The Acorn debacle was a ruse, as the whole videos were never released, unlike Shirley Sherrod and other misleading videos by Andrew Brietart.  Had someone actually tried to vote as Mickey Mouse THAT would have been voter fraud. Some poor, and some chemically dependent people, trying to earn more money by listing false names on sign-up lists doesn’t make it fraud.

    • Cordwin

      You’re right – voter registration has to be protected.  The fraud related to ACORN was in the manipulated, severely edited tapes created by James O’Keefe, which later analysis showed that he had constructed to suggest that he was proving illegal actions.  Independent investigations cleared ACORN – too late for its organization.

      • Jmc

        you must also include the manufacturers of voter registration machinery that ironically contribute thousands to the Republican campaigns

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    Is this an equally applied law?  In other words, is the burden on every voter in a state?  Then it’s not racist.  Does it address a legitimate problem?  In other words, do we want only citizens of this country and of the district in question to vote?  Then there’s no problem.

    • Cory

      But who is it intended to affect?  Do you deny that the republicans are pursuing this because it benefits them primarily?

      • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

        As does redistricting in states with a Republican legislature.  My point is that this type of law has legitimate reasons supporting it.

        • Cory

          A baseball bat is a tool for playing baseball (legitimate use) until it is put upside someone’s head, when it’s use becomes illegitimate.

    • Beckycarr100

      The inequality is in who is more likely to be affected. The old, the young, the poor, the disabled. The poor are disproportionately minorities, and they’re the ones who will have more problems getting to the right office when it’s open and paying any fees for necessary documentation. Will some people who vote Republican be inconvenienced or disenfranchised by these laws? You bet. There’s a lot of evidence that more of those affected will be Democrats than Republicans.

  • Jmc

    I
    mentioned it last week in the discussion of the Occupy Wall Street, protestors
    need to set up voter registration drives at the events, it is the one way that
    young and old can get the attention they will need for true fundamental change,
    make it a rally cry with voter registration card in hand. Start the movement today so your rights are not denied by falling into one of the cracks that are being created to do so.

  • BHA in Vermont

    Since the supreme court has given corporations the legal right to anonymously buy elections, why not just have them vote instead of individuals?

    • Ellen Dibble

      That would serve them right.  Let them take responsibility for the outcome.

    • Hypocrite

      And unions!  I’m sure you’re opposed to that as well – right?

      • BHA in Vermont

        Yes, include unions and PACs. Let them all vote and we can watch the results at home. :)

        ALL money given to a candidate for office or in support of/against a bill should be out in the open. The Koch brothers should not be able to fund anonymous ads all over the country. People are a lot less likely to support dubious, if not outright false, statements if their name is right out there.

        Corporations are NOT voters, neither are unions, nor PACs. I don’t care what the Supreme Court said. They failed miserably in this and in equating campaign spending to free speech and the first amendment. There is a BIG difference between ONE person standing up/stating their mind and influencing an election with huge amounts of funding no one besides the VERY rich could match.

        My proposed campaign finance reform plan:
        1) If a candidate or bill will not represent or affect you DIRECTLY, you may not give them ANY money/support. That means no one from one state can give money/support for or against a candidate or bill outside that state. Work it down all the way to city representation for cities big enough to have representatives based on a geographic area. If the laws passed are not covering you, you should have ZERO say in deciding WHO will make those laws or if a law is passed or not.
        2) For federal positions, you may ONLY give to candidates who represent your district (House) or state (Senate). They are there to represent the people in THEIR district/state, NOT people from others. That doesn’t mean they can’t work together for the common good of all people in the country, but their PRIMARY responsibility should be to support the desires of the people from THEIR district/state and those are the only people who should be affecting the election/vote.
        3) If ‘you’ are a corporation/union/non profit – you can spend only up to the same percentage of your total campaign donation money in a given area as you get from sales/donations (meaning TO a non profit) in that same area. You should not have representation greater than your ‘presence’.

        This is, of course, another of my job killing ideas as a lot less marketing would be done when people can’t try to influence voting outside their represented area.

    • Hypocrite

      And unions!  I’m sure you’re opposed to that as well – right?

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    Rhode Island’s plan sounds good–show us that you live here.  To what does Berman object there?

    • litekeep of Sutton, MA

      Listen to the show Greg.  There’s a lot to object to.  Charging people for ID, allowing Gun IDs to work, but not Student IDs, these are legitimate questions.  I’m not saying that the I’m for nor against this issue.  I’m saying that these are legitimate questions which should be discussed.  Denying people of their right to vote, that sounds absolutely un-American.

  • Emjones

    Wait until the Republicans discover they have disenfranchised their toothless, trailerpark, good-old-boy, racist, clueless voters.

    • Lisa

      EXCELLENT! 

    • Lisa

      EXCELLENT! 

  • Getalife

    Is there a more annoying person on the earth than this Ari guy?  God forbid you actually have to prove who you are to vote lol. 

    • Anonymous

      Berman writes well and cogently. He’s an effective investigative reporter and analyst.  This is the first time I’ve heard him speak and he wasn’t very clear.  Pity, because he’s good.

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    I worked for the Department of Human Services in 2004.  We were required to offer the clients the opportunity to register to vote.  One client took the form and then asked me if she should bother.  She wondered if it were an election year.

    There are times when democracy is its own worst argument.

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    I worked for the Department of Human Services in 2004.  We were required to offer the clients the opportunity to register to vote.  One client took the form and then asked me if she should bother.  She wondered if it were an election year.

    There are times when democracy is its own worst argument.

  • TFRX

    ALEC? Let’s hear more about them.

    There’s something about right-wingers saying “states rights”, and then finding out there’s a shadowy one-size-fits-all organization giving each state the same boilerplate legislation.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1816544 Dan Trindade

    Why do Republican politicans resort to voter ID laws in the first place? Are they that threatened by the potential power of liberal voters that they must resort to gutting the Voting Rights Act and removing the right to vote of the estimated five million voters disenfranchised by these laws? Are there statistics to support calls for voter ID laws or are they largely based in just the perception of fraud and waste?

    • Egglda

      They are trying to stop people from voting illegally. Yes, the liberals want to allow anyone to vote, we want US citizens only, voting. If you don’t have an ID, get one, if you can’t get an ID then you probably aren’t a citizen and shouldn’t vote.

      • Rnadeau77

        While you think we should be required to have an ID that you are also opposed to government being involved in our business and you would probably also be opposed to having a national ID. Why not issue everyone a national ID?

      • Anonymous

        Most illegal voting that actually occurs wouldn’t be stopped by requiring photo ID.  Look at Mitt Romney’s illegal voting in Massachusetts.
        http://motherjones.com/mojo/2011/06/did-mitt-romney-commit-voter-fraud

        • TFRX

          Poor guy, sleeping in a basement. At least he cleaned the Cheetos dust off before running for the nomination.

      • Beckycarr100

        FALSE! There are large numbers of citizens in the country who don’t have the kinds of Photo ID required by these laws. Some never got a birth certificate (born at home many decades ago), some don’t have a currently valid driver’s license (too old, blind, disabled), some don’t have driver’s license because they don’t own a car, etc.

    • Beckycarr100

      The number of proven cases of voter impersonation is minuscule, statistically insignificant. Voter impersonation is the only type of fraud that can be prevented by having to show a picture ID at the polls. 

  • Tim

    Democrats should stop complaining, and fight right back! Take these new laws to court! Launch ballot initiatives! Do something about it!

  • L R Dunn

    When more Americans turn out in National elections the GOP loses.

    • Jmc

      you are right, how do we get the message across to the 99%

    • Rnadeau77

      REQUIRE VOTING!

  • Katskillkid55

    I see nothing wrong with showing a form of picture ID in order to vote. Especially proving that you are an American citizen. Why would anyone be opposed to this? This isn’t new, we all knew this was coming.

  • Roland

    Remember also, to quote the mantra from where I went to college — “Leges sine moribus vanae — Laws without morals are useless/in vain” –that these Republican-pushed voter restriction laws are nothing less than evil and destroy democracy, which is based on voting!

  • Bill

    Going into the millennium, it was so neck and neck between the red and the blue.

    As more and more US citizens become economically disenfranchised, the only way the 1% will keep the 99% neutralized (canceling each other out at the polls) is to turn away more and more of those economically disenfranchised voters.

  • TFRX

    Okay, now we’ve got to the propaganda part of our program. Is there a right-winger who can make a better case for this than Torchinsky?

    And, Tom, a guest has to remind you of Katherine Harris’s possible criminal acts as vote-scrubbing SecState of Florida in 2000? Isn’t this required reading?

    • http://www.facebook.com/drpmeade Paul S Meade

      The simple solution is to make a valid voter ID that is easily obtained and free to those eligible. Anyone who would oppose that would obviously be biased, left or right. Not that state or federal bureaucracies want anything simple however.

      • TFRX

        Solution to what? What voter fraud? Why do they have such a stiffie to do this now RIGHTTHISVERYSECOND?

        And the solutions in many a state are not simple, easily obtained or free. They are lip-service in passing, and logistical nightmares. That is a feature, not a bug.

  • Yar

    In the book Starship Troopers, one had to serve a term of service to earn the right to vote.  What would our country look like if only VETS voted?

  • Scott B, Jamestown NY

    In the automotive world the “Magnussen Act” requires that any automaker that requires a specific oil (or other fluid other than gas) that that company provide it for FREE.  This rule should be applied to state. the onus should be on them to prove beyond reasonable doubt that a person does not have the right to vote.

    It’s not just the poor that are being disenfranchised here.  How many people in NYC, or other big cities with a large public transportation network many use, have drivers licenses? What about the people in all  the recent disaster areas where homes, municipal buildings, even hospitals were ruined, taking birth records with the water or wind? 

    Why, when a person has served his debt to society, does that person not get their right to vote back?  They can hold a job, they pay taxes, get counted in the census (even while incarcerated) but they can’t vote when they get out?

    The way things are shaping up it’s going to take a corporate building walking into a voting booth with a concealed weapons permit to cast a vote.

    I’ve never seen such fear, as shown by the Republican and Tea parties, against people and fact. Voter fraud straw-man fear mongering, unprecedented amounts of gerrymandering electoral districts, preventing satellites that are need by business and science from being launched because it might prove global warming… They want to go high-speed forward into the 19th century.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1816544 Dan Trindade

    I would like to see a national holiday to vote. Perhaps even a fine for failing to vote similar to what happens in Australia. Would this voter ID issue exist if voter participation was averaging better than 50%?

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    Early voting is a convenience, not a right.  I do wish that Election Day were a national holiday, but that’s the day.

    • Anonymous

      But voting is a right.  Why should we throw up unnecessary barriers for people to exercise that right?  There’s no particular reason to have one day of voting on a Tuesday, other than historical contingency.  Why shouldn’t we revisit and reform that to better fit with modern living?

      • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

        Modern doesn’t necessarily mean good.  There’s nothing wrong with having one day on which citizens go to choose their leaders.  That emphasizes the importance of the act.  What you call unnecessary, I see as a reasonable requirement.

        • Anonymous

          I didn’t say modern=good.  I’m saying our current system is just an accident of history, not a commandment written in stone, and there’s no reason not to revise it if it no longer works for us.

          A limited voting window disproportionately effects the poor, who are less able to take time off of work and family in order to vote, and may have a more difficult time commuting to voter centers.

          • brian parizek

            then the question becomes, what is a reasonable amount for a voting period?  do open all votes for 5 or 7 days?  over that amount of time you ought to be able to get your vote in

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            There’s nothing wrong with one day.  if you’re in line at closing time, you get to vote.  Having to stand in line isn’t excessive.

          • TFRX

            For three hours? By design, when a secretary of state doesn’t do their duty to make sure there are sufficient voting machines, and they’re working properly?

          • Beckycarr100

            How long do you expect someone in their eighties to stand in line? How about someone in ill health? What if your kids’ daycare center loses at 6? I’m so sick of people who’ve never had to worry about these kinds of things asserting that everything is so easy. Maybe for you it is easy, but maybe you think only you and people in your socioeconomic class should be deciding elections and those other people really don’t count.

        • Anonymous

          I didn’t say modern=good.  I’m saying our current system is just an accident of history, not a commandment written in stone, and there’s no reason not to revise it if it no longer works for us.

          A limited voting window disproportionately effects the poor, who are less able to take time off of work and family in order to vote, and may have a more difficult time commuting to voter centers.

        • Get UR ID Card

          We have 40% not graduating from High School and you think these people can read or analyze candidates? Without having an IQ test as a qualifier, I certainly can not approve of ALL people voting. Geez, next we will have gangbangers as elected officials? WARFARE will be next !!!!

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

    This OnPoint discussion today is just a red herring.  An obfuscation of the real problems of MONEY AND MEDIA corrupting elections… not voters.   Create fair elections and people will vote.

    • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

      How are they corrupted?  I research the candidates and make my choice.

      • Anonymous

        Aren’t you the guy constantly complaining bout how uninformed if not stupid so many of your college-age students are?  And of course statistics show that about half the population is dumber than average.  Where do you think you fit and how do you think you election prep compares to that done by the average voter?

    • Anonymous

      Those are also big problems, but preventing voters from doing so is also a big problem.

      Neil

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

        Solve the problem of a corrupt flawed system and the little problems like voter ID will go away.

        • Anonymous

          The “problem” of voter ID is created by those who want to limit other people’s ability to vote.  Sure, we need to solve a lot of problems, and some of them are interrelated, but to say we have to solve all the problems in our democracy before we start to solve one of the problems with our democracy — doesn’t make sense, and it is self-contradictory.

          We have to start fixing things somewhere, and reversing a self-inflicted problem would seem to be a fine place to start.

          Neil

  • Winston Smith

    Please spare us any quotes from Al Sharpton.  He is the one of the chief race baters in this country (remember Tawana Brawley)?  Anyone who disagrees with him is automatically a racist in his view.

    • Cory

      If Al showed up at your place of business in a panic to inform you your home was on fire, would you ignore him?  Would Tawana Brawley keep you from calling home to check?

  • Anonymous

    Tom,  

    I find this discussion very troubling not because new laws are preventing people from voting, but rather that some people like your guest are demonizing politicians for making sure the people allowed to vote are US Citizens.  Letting everyone from every country and of every mental capacity vote would not be good either.  

    I remember Wisconsin or Minnesota having more votes cast than voters in the district last year!  That is clearly fraud yet the left doesn’t want to do anything about it.  

    • TFRX

      Show me the fraud. You remember a lot of things.

    • Anonymous

      Garbage in = garbage out.  No wonder you reach some of the conclusions you post here.

  • Jmc

    Republican are simply capitalizing on the indifference that most potential voters have by adding one more task to vote, is it wrong, probably not, will it deter more people to not vote, if we go on the turnout track record yes because we have not become fed up enough to excercise the one thing we are still in control of and that is sad.

  • Kathy in Vermont

    When I first registered to vote in New Jersey (in 1976 at age 18), I was issued a voter registration card that was to be presented whenever I went to the polls to vote.  It was a very simple document, about the size of the pre-photo drivers’ licenses, and contained my name, city and county of residence, my signature and the location of the polling place where I was eligible to vote.  The signature was verified everytime I signed the book to vote.  I have lived many places since that time and have never again seen a voter registration ID. 

    I don’t see a problem requiring some form of identification.  Voting is not only a right, it is also an obligation.  I think the Boards of Election in each community is obligated to keep the process as secure as possible. The Department of Motor Vehicles offers a non-driver photo ID at less than the cost of a driver’s license.

    • TFRX

      From what I know of Vermont, they play things on the square up there.

      Do you really want your enfranchisement to be dependent on the whims of what hoops some racist Republican state leges can dream up that sound?

      There have been practice elections in at least one state to see what voting day will be like with the new laws. It’s a morass.

  • Kathy W

    Mr. Berman should get over himself. If he thinks it will be so onerous for some people to get photo ID then he should get out there with the neighborhood organizers and start a campaign to bring people to get their photo IDs. It has always seemed very odd to me that I don’t have to show ID to vote. Especially when I have to show so much ID for so many other purposes.

    • TFRX

      Let me guess: White. Suburban. Never had a sheriff or a deputy or a self-appointed “poll watcher” with firearms look at you while you waited to vote.

  • Lisa

    I too believe this is a republican effort to limit democrats at the poles but at the same time I have to wonder why any democrat would allow these laws to prevent them from voting.  If they want photo ID’s, then go get a license, passport or other ID.  The only way they can stop voters is if the voters aren’t paying attention so they don’t know about the new laws in their state or they can’t be bothered to go get the ID.  We need ID’s for all sorts of things in this country and if you don’t have one, then it’s time to get it, especially if your right to vote is at stake.  Basically, I’m saying fight back!    

    • Anonymous

      It’s the principle of the matter.  There is no law, nor should there be, to have a drivers’ license or state ID card.  Should the most fundamental right in a democracy be abridged because someone chooses not to have one?  I should be essentially forced to pay the government a fee (cost of the ID) in order to exercise this most basic of rights?

      • Jmc

        you are right Eric, if an ID is required then it shoud be provided specifically for voting without a cost attached

        • Drozenson

          Not just an important principle: this is the equivalent of an unconstitutional poll tax. (24th Amendment)

      • Lisa

        I’m on the fence about this ID issue but my real point is that if you don’t have a photo ID and your state requires it, don’t let them stop you from voting!  Until the laws are overturned, there are two choices, get the ID to vote or don’t get the ID and be stopped from voting.  I’m saying go get the ID!  There is no way I’d give up my right to vote just because my state requires a photo ID.  If you get the ID, their law becomes moot and they lose!   Hopefully, the laws will be overturned but until then, we can’t let them stop us from voting.    

    • Beckycarr100

      That’s easy for an able-bodied, white, middle-class person to say. What if you’re disabled and have to rely on others to take you everywhere you need to go? What if you don’t have a car or public transportation to get to the nearest DMV office? What if the DMV office is closed on your day off, and if you don’t show up, you don’t get paid (no paid time off, no paid sick days)? What if you’re an elderly black person born at home in the Jim Crow South and never had a birth certificate? What if your driver’s license is expired because you can no longer drive, but you never had a birth certificate? South Carolina is requiring that your photo ID be currently valid under the new law. What if you’re a student who never got a driver’s license because your family doesn’t own a car? What if you lost your birth certificate in a fire and couldn’t afford the fees to replace it? What if you can’t afford a passport? What if you’re homeless – what do you use for an address? I’m sick of hearing this argument from people who have no clue how difficult life can be for some of the people on the margins of society.

  • Roland

    For more information on Republican  voter fraud that got Bush a second stolen term and has shaped this nation downward, check out Bob Fritakis’s Free Press article, “New Court Filing Reveals How the 2004 Ohhio Presidential Election Was Hacked”

  • Anonymous

    Jamie Raskin pretty much has the case against the Republicans sewn up.  He was in great contrast to Jason Torchinsky who seems unable to match noun to verb and grinds out the party line.  I kind of think people like Torchinsky who muddle language when they speak are saddled with muddled brains — with the exception of people who aren’t used to speaking in public.

    The timing is the key.  If we decide to go with voter ID, we need to have it in place and fully available to all citizens well before we even discuss applying that requirement at the polls.

  • Bill

    The bigger issue is this obsession with Tuesday being election day.

    There are millions of workers and single parents who don’t vote simply because they can’t.

    • Voter fraud

      Bill, if you work for a company that will not give you time to go vote, then you work for the wrong company and should publish their name so we can correct their bad behavior. On the other hand, voters need to be educated well enough to know how to fill out absentee voter forms. Education seems to be the primary reason for ID cards, so that person is voting and not a relative.

      • TFRX

        “then you work for the wrong company and should publish their name so we can correct their bad behavior”

        Do you have any idea which companies are behind ALEC, and call themselves “100% American” and wear flag pins?

      • Beckycarr100

        Limits on absentee voting and early voting are other facets of this disenfranchisment push.

  • Rex

    Did Jason Torchinsky really just say that voter turnout was not negatively affected by mandatory voter ID in 2008?  Seriously?

  • Ellen Dibble

    Where I live, I believe the verification that I’m a citizen goes on when I register to vote.  Then a huge list is compiled, I believe by hand, showing my address, in street-order order, and the number of voters at this unit.  I tell my name address and then my name, and they check me off.  When I finish voting, people at another table go through the IDENTICAL process.  One ballot goes into the machine under their vigilance.
         Contrast that to my getting pseudephedrine for sinus headaches. I have to bring my passport now, if my license is misplaced.  If the passport is misplaced, I end up calling the State Department and get an investigator wondering what the heck.

  • Nebraska Voter

    One of the problems we are anticipating with the Voter ID law here in Nebraska is not just a lack of ID, but inaccurate identification.  In impoverished and minority communities we tend to have fairly unstable neighborhoods, and constantly focus on updating registrations.  Now we have to focus on updating identification as well.  

  • Constantinos

    It’s one of the few times that I feel as nauseated listening to
    Democrats on this program as I feel everytime Tom has GOP or crypto-GOP
    guests. The amount of excuses made for a system that is so allowing to
    cheating is staggering. In civilized societies you should have some form
    of ID – and usually when it comes to elections it is a form of
    election-specific ID. Instead of accepting that and asking for that to
    be made available to all they ask for a broken system to be perpetuated
    because it favors them.

    They keep talking about no problem of
    fraud but the way the system is there is no real way to discover fraud.
    So quoting studies is a joke. I vote in MA and the level of checking is a
    joke. I could double and triple vote without a problem. Hell, I could
    have registered all these years that I was in the country as a legal
    immigrant but not a citizen all based on my statement that I was a
    citizen on the form that was mailed to my house! It’s a complete joke!
    And to hear these people make excuses for such a sorry system makes me
    want to puke given that we support the same party.

    I come from a
    European country where you get “registered” at birth or naturalization
    and a voter ID card awaits you when you become eligible (at 18 or at
    naturalization if you are 18). The whole concept of registering and
    registration drives is ridiculous. The USA should get serious about this – instead your guests are defending a silly system that can be taken advantage of extremely easily.

    • Jmc

      you would think that we could develop a more accurate system such as the one you discussed

      • Anonymous

        The problem,of course, lies not in having an ID requirement. It lies in how those in authority use the ability to identify and label individuals.  Unfortunately we already have, on the one hand, individuals who blithely give personal information to corporate interests, and on the other government entities having the ability to keep and store information about us that might prove useful… to them.  We should be more careful about our personal information (I’m bad about this myself) and much more vigilant with respect to authority we give to “law enforcement” and “national security” organizations — both of which need a lot more scrutiny than any American voter!

    • Jmc

      you would think that we could develop a more accurate system such as the one you discussed

    • Beth

      You must live in a different MA than I do; when I vote here, they cross my name off a list and if I tried to cast another ballot, the rolls would show that I’d already voted and they wouldn’t give me one.  I agree that the US ought to issue voter ID free of cost, but in the absence of such a sane system, shouldn’t we respond to the problem we know exists (the burdens we currently place on would-be voters) rather than the problem there’s absolutely no evidence of?

      • Constantinos

        What I mean is that I could go to another polling station, give a different name (ideally for a person that I know is not voting that day or has not voted already) and vote again. Not vote for myself multiple times – if the system allowed that it would be even more of a joke than it already is.

  • Jeff in MN

    I live in Minnesota and I think voter ID is a great idea.  During the Franken vs Coleman election the winner had only around 200 votes more than the loser of that contest.  We had many hundreds of ineligable felons that voted in that election (all their votes counted) and yet only a few dozen felons were prosecuted because you have to “knowingly” vote illegally to be prosecuted.  The key is to inform the illegal voter by checking their ID, let them know they are most likely voting illegally and let them fill out a ballot if they insist but afterwards if it turns out they shouldn’t be voting they will be found guilty because they were informed before voting.

    • Beckycarr100

      First of all, why shouldn’t a felon who has served his sentence be allowed to vote? Is losing your citizenship rights for the rest of your life part of the sentence? Second, what are they going to do, run everyone’s license through a convicted felon database right there in the voting line? As if you don’t have to wait long enough already? What if the database is inaccurate?

      • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

        Felons have shown themselves to be unreliable and bad citizens.  Why should they get rights back?  There may be an answer to that, but they should have to prove it.

        • Beckycarr100

          How? You know there’d have to be another government program for that, don’t you?

  • Beckycarr100

    Your caller from South  Carolina said you need photo ID to register to vote. This isn’t true. You can use a current utility, bill bank statement, paycheck or government document with your current name and address in the county where you’re registering in lieu of photo ID under current law. The best that anyone in SC can do is register NOW, and go back to the voter registration office to trade in their voter registration card for one with photo ID when they get their cameras up and running. The Voter ID law, if it passes Voting Rights Act muster, will disenfranchise a lot of legitimate voters because of the cost and hassle of getting birth certificates, etc., and will cost the state a lot of money to solve a non-existent problem.
    Rebecca Carr, Effingham, SC

    • TFRX

      Thank you for the clarification.

      Where I live, the SecState is on TV after Columbus Day every voting year, telling people what to do and when to do it by.

      In some states, pollworkers aren’t required to tell a voter that, say after moving or redistricting, that they’ve gone to the wrong precinct to cast their vote. (Thanks, Republicants!)

      How hard are South Carolina’s self-appointed guardians of the vote working to make sure everyone knows this?

      • Beckycarr100

        The governor pulled a one-day publicity stunt to take people who needed a ride to DMV offices to got photo ID. The League of Women Voters is working on it publicizing the issue. People who don’t have birth certificates and try to get photo ID at DMV really have a job ahead of them.

  • Scott B, Jamestown NY

    The League of Women Voters should be doing it anyway! Not much was accomplished in the country that bettered us as a people, and as a country, that was done because someone did it anyway. From colonials making their own metal farming implements and guns, to black students refusing to leave “whites only” lunch counters.  

  • Jeff in MN

    BTW, when Franken did finally take the senate office he was the last senator that was needed to get Obamacare passed; so not having voter ID has already affected our lives.

  • Vendetta73

    I care deeply about the integrity of elections in this country, but until today I had the crazy idea that integrity in elections meant making sure that votes represented the will of the greatest possible number of citizens.  Thanks to your Republican guests for correcting my mistake. 

    (By the way, when Jason Torchinsky points out that black turnout in Georgia in 2008 increased by a whopping 2%, he neglects to mention that this was in a year in which black turnout was up almost 5%.)

  • Dugg Antocicco

    How do we know there is no fraud? If there hasn’t been a way to identify a voter, how can you know if every vote was genuine?

    • TFRX

      In the boy-who-cried-wolf manner, Fox and Rush and such will report every voting fraud instance, and for each one, a thousand that don’t exist.

  • Anonymous

    Just another unprincipled political strategy by those who call for deregulation in areas that scream for more regulation but have no reservations about adding more government control in areas that do not require it.  It’s all about winning and control, not anyone’s rights.

  • Binney Eli

    Our voting system is broken.

    First past the post represses 3rd party opinions, Gerrymandering overwhelmingly benefits incumbents, voting machines are easily tampered with, and having voting day on Tuesday prevents working class people from voting.

    The war on voting has been waging since this country was founded. This is just the latest battle.

    • Cory

      Bimney Eli, I’d like to buy you an ale or lager of your choosing!  I’m even going throw in some salty pretzels.

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    It’s standard for felons not being allowed to vote.  I can’t get too worried over this.

    • John in Amherst

      It’s standard for fellons to pay their debt to society by going to prison.  After that, they have “paid up”.  But not in your ledger, eh?   

      • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

        Perhaps, but i just can’t worry too much about them.  After all, they’ve shown themselves to be unreliable.

    • TFRX

      I’d like the corresponding restriction of felonious corporations to not lobby.

      Considering the drug war and how “felon” meant so many different things back in, say, 1970, I don’t know about that. And the whole crack v. cocaine sentencing guidelines are a problem in that also.

      • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

        Who was forced to commit those crimes?  I do think that our drug war is silly and that corporations are not persons, but that doesn’t excuse someone who broke a law that was not immoral.

        • TFRX

          The drug war’s “getting tough on crime” thing has gone broad-brushly overboard, to the detriment of other policing. One of those things was the crack v. cocaine sentencing guidelines, for example.

          People our age would do something and be arrested for a misdemeanor, now in the age of “D.A.R.E.”, that same thing would be a felony.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            I don’t like our drug policy, but I don’t see taking currently illegal drugs as a civil right.  If you want to take the risk, be ready to take the consequences.

          • TFRX

            The escalation of misdemeanor to felony, especially w.r.t. crack v. cocaine, during the first flush of the “stop the madness” years, has resulted in racially imbalanced arrests and prosecutions.

            If it were the other way around, I wonder what the Rick Scotts and Ken Blackwells and Mario Rubios would say?

  • Dawn

    Ok, so African American voting rates went up in 2008 after the voter ID laws. But how can we ignore the increased voter rates across the board due to President Obama’s motivating people on both sides of the aisle??

  • Dawn

    Ok, so African American voting rates went up in 2008 after the voter ID laws. But how can we ignore the increased voter rates across the board due to President Obama’s motivating people on both sides of the aisle??

  • Malcolm White

    apparently the republican governors and legislatures are more interested in “cleaning up” the voter rolls than cleaning up the environment, and have more faith in mega banks to police themselves than they have in the average voter to do the same.

  • Jeff in MN

    In most states felons are ineligable to vote because they haven’t served their full time in prison.  They get an early release and still are on parole, once they are off parole and have served their full term (assigned by a court) they generally get their voting rights back.

  • John in Amherst

    The GOP worries about fraud? Voting fraud?  Like the Ohio 2004 results being hacked and favoring Bush?  Like the 2000 vote in Florida, where the conservatives on the Supreme Court had to step in and stop a recount that would have given the election to Gore? 
    The GOP is the “law and order party” only when the laws favor the Republican order.  When the laws don’t favor the GOP, there are plenty of deep pocketed groups like ALEC to push for new laws.  The GOP has been busying itself since the Regan years with a strategy to manipulate the election process from the local level on up.  The effort has reached a crescendo with ALEC and the fight to redraw the congressional map after the last census.  They deserve kudos for their vision and tenacity.  They deserve vilification for the descrimination and disenfranchisement that are the fruits of their labors.  Again, the rich elite that funds and directs the GOP relies on the scare tactics and xenophobia to manipulate the rank and file GOP to ensure a political milleux that favors profits above people, environmental exploitation over prudent husbandry, short term economic gain over the health and wellbeing of society.  
    The reliance on pleas for fairness, moral indignation and ineffectual whining from Democrats is not enough.  The Dems need to wise up and get tough.  They are in a fight to the death with a foe that knows no shame.      

  • Julie in Iowa City

    This feels to me like a real Lakoff moment where once again the Republicans have managed to brand things in a profoundly deceptive way.  Why aren’t we calling this like it is?  The real, massive voter fraud in this country is precisely the manipulation that the Republican party is perpetrating before our very eyes: all the redistricting, and now these new regulations, are just the next chapter after the blatant criminal abuse of the Bush-Gore election.

  • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

    If a voter says, “Why bother,” I have to wonder why that person ought to vote.

  • Scott B, Jamestown NY

    Some would think that getting a driving license is a few dollars at the DMV and it’s not. Many state require a lecture class that are from $80 – $200; then require driver training that can be from a few hundred for a high school student through his school, to several hundred for private driver training. Let’s not forget that many might have to forgo some pay as they  have to schedule a drivers test during work hours.

    ***

    One would think that college students have been through enough matriculation that they’ve proven who they are, and that they’re seeking higher education should be a plus. But they aren’t equal to someone with a weapons permit?

  • JayB

    Wait, your guest concludes a rise in the black vote in Virgina (was it?) the last presidential election means these laws aren’t having any suppressive effect?

    Gee, I wonder if there was anything about that election that might have brought out the black vote?  How did the rate of black turnout compare to other states without these laws?

  • grow UP

    Having a Driver’s Lic or Photo I.D. is no big deal if you are sober and sane. It should be mandatory to always have a photo ID on your person, if out in public. If a young man is suppose to register at 18 yrs, then all people need to get legal identification by 18 years. The excuses I am hearing on your show are LAME. The excuses for not getting an ID card makes these people unqualified to vote, so what’s the problem.

    • Jmc

      so you would support a tax that provides voter I.D for legal residents that cannot afford it or access the location to acquire the I.D.?

    • Guest

      Being disabled without a ride to the ID office that’s 40 miles away is a lame excuse? In Kentucky (where some official candidates support this legislation for our state) we have roughly 800-1200 homeless war veterans sleeping on the street at night- their lack of address is a lame excuse? I would never tell a vet he/she isn’t qualified to vote…

    • Anonymous

      You are not required to be sober or sane to be able to vote.  Your comment is insulting and demeaning and you are revealing your bias.

      Getting voter ID *is* a big deal for some people; like the elderly, or poor, or disabled, or those without a driver’s license, or those who don’t speak English, or who are living in a rural area, or where there is no public transportation, or work during the time that these offices are open, or have other impediments to getting there.

      Neil

    • Beckycarr100

      Why not just insert microchips in everyone at birth? 1984, big Brother is watching you. Is this still the land of the free?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/David-Grudem/705892686 David Grudem

    The organizations that are complaining about these voting restrictions should put their dollars where their mouth is…actually organize to help the undocumented few to get the proper documents and then help them get the proper voting document. When they whine and stamp their feet instead of providing the boots-on -the-ground help they are just making futile noise and justifying their fat salaries.

    • TFRX

      “fat salaries”

      Hahaha, at the League of Women Voters? Who, apparently, aren’t helping people to register?

      And there’s something cute about being on fairly equal ground and being able to state their case without Fox News controlling the mic, and having dipwads like you call that “whining”. To everyone else, it’s an essential part of public relations.

    • Anonymous

      If the law is onerous, then how is it fair to make the victims figure out how to meet the unfair demands?  This is presuming they are guilty until they prove they are innocent.

      These voter ID laws are wrongheaded at best, and cynical at worst.

      Neil

    • Beckycarr100

      Because it’s a bad law. There’s already plenty of volunteer work that needs done without passing laws to add a need for more to solve a practically nonexistent problem (voter impersonation) at great cost.

  • Dana

    1. Make the election day a national holiday or move elections to a Sunday or Saturday
    2. Abolish the antiquated electoral college system and change it to the simple arithmetic majority – that is the real democracy (by the way it should apply to the Senate as well)

  • Dsweeton

    In 2000 and 2004 the Republicans manipulated the voting process with Diebold voting machines that could change votes electronically. Gathering to Save Democracy fought diligently to replace these in Tennessee with  reliable paper ballot machines. When the Republicans took over the legislature, they have refused to emplement these. Instead they have passed this photo ID requirement, disenfranchising many voters. What is their next move to steal elections or will they just declare themselves supreme rulers?

  • Jeff in MN

    Hey NPR, I just gave a great example where voter ID would have changed an election; please use that example on the radio!!!!

    • Vendetta73

      Hey, Jeff, apparently you don’t read the news when the stories in it don’t suit you; your “example” has long since been shown to be a bunch of hooey!!!!

  • Hitex100

    Aren’t the Republicans moaning that we shouldn’t be “required” to get health insurance but yet they think we should be required to go and get an additional ID to vote ??? Yeah, right. It’s clearly a ploy to keep people out and total BS.

    • Scott B, Jamestown NY

      Hypocrisy is the hallmark of the Right these days.  Look at Florida and Rick Scott – He wanted to “get government out of people’s lives.”  So what happened? All government employees started having to be drug tested, regardless of the fact that there’s no evidence it’s a problem.  Now all social services recipients have to be drug tested, and, again, there’s no evidence that there’s a large problem. Nationally, about 7% of Americans have some degree of dependency. For those on social services that number drops to about 2%. The food stamps are mostly supposed to be helping the children stay nourished, but if mom or dad tests for a drug then, somehow, that parent is going to be taking the food stamp food and fencing it for Oxycontin? “Hey, I got a sweet deal on some milk and bread, man.”  Really?

  • Mary Mancini

    Please sign the petition to repeal the photo ID to vote law in Tennessee at http://www.tnca.org.

  • EdwardBurke

    Mr. Berman betrays no familiarity with the circumstances in
    Dillon County, South Carolina, where the local political establishment is that
    of the Democratic Party (Senator Obama campaigned in the County in August 2007,
    so while the County remains a rural backwater in a state widely perceived as
    parochial or provincial, the County’s Democratic Party is closely tied in to
    the machinations of the SC Democratic Party and the national Democratic Party).

    To this day, 17 October 2011, as for the past twenty years
    and more, the County’s Democratic political machine has not allowed votes to be
    cast for ANY County or municipal school board (four such boards of trustees
    existed twenty years ago; due to district consolidation, only three now exist,
    one County board and two municipal boards). The Democratic chairman of the
    County Board has been unelected and continuously appointed to office by two Democratic
    State senators and the local Democratic State representative to the General
    Assembly in Columbia since 1990. Two referenda have passed (one by a narrow
    margin in 1990, one by a huge majority just in November 2010) calling for an
    elected County Board. The two Democratic State senators and the Democratic
    State representative all failed to introduce legislation in the 2011 General
    Assembly to accede to what voters unambiguously called for.  There’s now virtually no chance that an
    election for local school boards can be held in November 2012.

    This is not a case of Democrats sitting on the voting
    process (they dealt with their vote-buying scandal back in the 1980s): this is
    a clear case of DEMOCRATS sitting on DEMOCRACY ITSELF. Year after year, and
    decade after decade, SC state Democrats and US national Democrats (some of whom
    HAVE to be aware of this problem, since Senator Obama campaigned in this
    Democratic stronghold and has himself since promised $35 million+ in “stimulus
    funds” to replace a school campus barely a quarter-century old) have failed to
    address this problem and are quite satisfied to see thousands of Dillon County
    residents (white and black, male and female) without any accountability in the
    administration of public schools, which engenders a deep disaffection for the
    whole notion of “public education”.   –THANK YOU, DEMOCRATS.

  • Anonymous

    One thing we on the left really need to do:  urge our local party structures to organize volunteers who will –tirelessly! — help the poor and elderly get their photo ID’s.  Some of us volunteer to take people to appointments with their doctors, others help distribute Meals on Wheels.  Now we need a similar effort to help make the ID easy to obtain from the moment these laws are passed, state by state.

  • RLarschan

    These laws discriminate against women who cannot drive.  Many women in their nineties never learned to drive.  Case in point-my mother and her four sisters, all in their nineties living in Indiana that now requires a voter ID.

  • Guest

    Quick this hours show is over, to the next message board!

  • Cory

    Lower voter turnout favors republicans.  If every American were required to vote by law republicans would win no elections outside of carefully gerrymandered districts.  This is neither about democracy nor fairness.  It is about power, plain and simple. 

    • Jasoturner

      I think once our country starts charging it’s employees – oops, er, citizens – $1,000 for the privilege, the republican party will declare victory and put the issue to bed once and for all.

  • Jeff in MN

    NPR, your liberal bias is showing again…I heard about 4-5 times how voter ID isn’t needed and that there were very few cases and that it wouldn’t effect an election.  I gave you a very clear example where lack of voter ID definately made a difference (2008 MN Senate Election), yet not a peep about it and the show even ended with a caller who said there were no cases of voter fraud in the US…yeah right, we know which side NPR is supporting.

    • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

      Just because there wasn’t time to get to you does not mean that NPR is biased.  Don’t be so self-important.

      • Jeff in MN

        I don’t care if it’s my comment getting on the air, it’s the perspective that was lacking on the show that I’m disappointed by.  Do some research on the 2008 MN Senate election before making a misguided comment, voter ID would have clearly made a difference in that election.  It’s not about being self-important it’s about moving the conversation forward.

        • Vendetta73

          Ironic, the call for “research.”  Do two minutes of it yourself and you’ll find out that your 2008 MN Senate election hobbyhorse won’t run…it was a totally fabricated story.  For someone who can root out the slightest trace of “liberal bias,” you’re sure pretty trusting when it comes for information propagated by Republican-affiliated interest groups.

          • Jeff in MN

            The conservative group found around 13,000 felons+ who voted within that group 700-800 were actually ineligible but only a few dozen of them were prosecuted due to the fact that the parole officer would have had to specifically told the felon they were not eligible to vote (and they have to specifically remember that conversation).  Voter ID would verify that individual was who they say they were (not just a simliar name) and there should be an ineligible voter list with felons and known illegal aliens who do not have the right to vote.  Also, voter ID would definately verify that individual voted in the election; right now you can just claim it was someone else with a similiar name or that someone else voted in your name, without voter ID that’s impossible to prove in court! DO MORE RESEARCH!

          • Jeff in MN

            “Of 1,359 suspected ineligible felons originally brought forward to Hennepin and Ramsey County officials, the vast majority have been withdrawn, found to be unsubstantiated, or erroneous. Ramsey County officials say they are still examining 180 cases; Hennepin County says it’s still looking at 216.”

            http://www.startribune.com/politics/98472564.html?page=3&c=y

            That’s just 2 counties in MN, plus they have to prove the felons actually knew they voted illegally.

            216 + 180 = 396 (and that’s just in two counties).
            Franken won by 312.

          • Vendetta73

            396 is the number of cases that were not immediately dismissed but required further investigation.  So yes, if all of them turned out to cases of ineligible voting, and all of them voted for Franken, they may have turned the election.  But neither of those things are facts, or indeed terribly likely.

    • Scott B, Jamestown NY

      It’s interesting, and sad for this country,  how anything that’s even a hair-left of Fox “News” is “liberal” to some.

      • Jeff in MN

        Sorry but I’m not a right winger, and I don’t watch Fox News (they’re too far to the right).  I’m an independent and I watch CNN, I realize they lean slightly to the left but at least they try for the middle ground MSNBC and FOX don’t even bother.  I also listen to lots of NPR and I point out their bias when I see it (or hear it in this case).

        • TFRX

          The CNN who is chasing the Tea Party lean slightly to the left?

          • Jeff in MN

            Well you missed the morning when CNN had one Tea Party group on TV and Ali Veshi basically said that the Tea Party was lying when the TP said not increasing the debt limit would not lead to a default on the debt.  Ali Veshi was wrong…yet he claimed the TP was lying…CNN likes to use the TP as a prop to show what’s wrong with conservatives…sometimes they have a point.  BTW, the Obama administration said they would prioritize the spending so we would not default on the US debt if the debt limit was not raised; Ali Veshi was definately wrong in that case.

          • TFRX

            One little point in the debt ceiling humdrummery, which became a crisiss!!!1!!one! when a black Democrat was elected to the White House.

            CNN is going after Tea Party viewers. It has tilted their coverage and framing.

          • Jeff in MN

            [Congress resists a White House request to raise the limit on how much the U.S. can borrow. The president warns of disaster. And the fight goes down to the wire.
            Sounds like the current budget standoff, right? Or the famous dustup between President Clinton and a Republican Congress in 1995-96?
            Try 1962. That’s when President John F. Kennedy pushed a conservative-leaning Congress to raise the federal debt limit by several billion dollars, implying that failure to do so could harm the military. Some Republicans later accused the administration of political “blackmail.” ]

            http://www.marketwatch.com/story/fights-over-debt-limit-have-long-history-2011-07-28

            This has been going on for a very long time…it’s not about the color of one man’s skin.

          • TFRX

            It was a humdrum thing to do. Check the lack of coverage in the media over the 9 times it was done for Shrub. Now, black Democrat, and all of a sudden the R’s call it a crisis.

    • Vendetta73

      So not mentioning claims of voter fraud in MN that were raised by a conservative interest group and were thoroughly debunked by election officials is now evidence of “liberal bias”?  (The group that reported on supposed “fraud” counted as ineligible felons everyone whose original sentence would have rendered them ineligible to vote in 2008, and had no access to information about sentence reductions that would have allowed many of those people to vote legally; they also had no way of verifying that the voters in question weren’t just people with the same name as an ineligible felon, so if there was a “John Smith” ineligible to vote in MN, every vote from a “John Smith” was counted as fraudulent.)

      At any rate, maybe the reason they didn’t air your comment is that you fail to mention how requiring ID would stop your theoretical felons from voting in future elections…they weren’t after all, pretending to be other people or ineligible to receive a state-issued ID.

      • Jeff in MN

        Yes, what you’re saying is true…but the conservative group found around 13,000 felons+ who voted within that group 700-800 were actually ineligible but only a few dozen of them were prosecuted due to the fact that the parole officer would have had to specifically told the felon they were not eligible to vote (and they have to specifically remember that conversation).  Voter ID would verify that individual was who they say they were (not just a simliar name) and there should be an ineligible voter list with felons and known illegal aliens who do not have the right to vote.  Also, voter ID would definately verify that individual voted in the election; right now you can just claim it was someone else with a similiar name or that someone else voted in your name, without voter ID that’s impossible to prove in court!

        • Vendetta73

          Huh?  Minnesota Majority (the group in question) only claimed to have found 341 ineligible votes (that’s the number that local officials found to be inflated).  No one pretended to be anyone other than who they were, so voter ID wouldn’t have been relevant in the few cases of people voting who weren’t eligible.  And if polling officials had accurate lists of those ineligible to vote (which I agree they should), that would allow them to prevent the right people from voting; how does it matter whether those people have an ID or not?

          • Jeff in MN

            Voter ID would definately verify that a specific individual voted in the election; right now you can just claim it was someone else with a similiar name or that someone else voted in your name, without voter ID that’s impossible to prove in court!

          • Vendetta73

            But no one has done this!  You’re going to impose a burden on every single voter to prevent something that there’s no evidence of ever having happened?

        • Elizabeth in RI

          Actually, shouldn’t the voter REGISTRATION process in MN have picked up the problems with felons?? And if it didn’t how would the use of voter IDs correct that?? A license showing that John Smith in St Paul is THE John Smith living on Main St in St Paul doesn’t indicate that he is an ineligible voter – just that he is John Smith.  So in fact what MN needs is a better voter registration process if allowing people who have served their time is such a problem.

          • Jeff in MN

            Good point, the conservative group in question sent a list of dead people and ineligible felons to the Secretary of State in MN a month BEFORE the election.  The MN Secretary of State refused to look at the list and did not purge the voter registration lists before the election, in fact he went on TV and said everyone come out and vote and don’t worry about the conservative group because MN is not going to purge the voter registrations.  That’s why it was such a big deal AFTER the election that even a single ineligible felon voted!

          • Vendetta73

            That’s exactly right.  Some people registered despite being ineligible, and most of the people who were charged in MN were charged with illegal registration, not illegal voting, because once the state erroneously let them register they couldn’t really be faulted for thinking they were allowed to vote.  Others had registered before their convictions, in which case the state was supposed to update the voter rolls to reflect that they were no longer eligible.  There was no case of anyone pretending to be anyone else, so verifying identities simply wasn’t the issue here.  And everything suggests that what happened in MN was simply that a few people who had been convicted and released didn’t realize they weren’t yet eligible to vote again, the state’s bureaucracy didn’t catch the error at registration or at the voting booth, and so they voted. 

            And then, of course, no one knows who they voted for.  Even if there had been 341 ineligible votes (which there weren’t), 92% of them would have had to be for Franken to affect the election, which seems like a bit of a stretch. 

          • Modavations

            Another acrobat.Your contortions are excruciating

    • Beckycarr100

      You can’t expect a reply to every call and email in the limited time frame of a radio show segment. Besides which, the law against felons voting is just another ploy to limit the franchise. 

  • Scott B, Jamestown NY

    This needs to be an issue at the Federal level. If the voters’ rights acts were federal, this needs to be federal.

    It’s also time that the Electoral College was put to an end.  . It would bring out more voters if they thought their vote would actually count.  At one time, when this country was new and some states were vastly more heavily populated, the Electoral College was a good idea to better level the field.  But now it’s only lent to swing state tipping the scales for attention.  I’d like to see a presidential race where candidates had to pay attention to everyone, not just Pennsylvania, Ohio, Florida, and the few others.  Last I knew we had 50 states, and a few territories,  that could vote, not just handful. One person, one vote.

    And while I’m at it – Let D.C. residents vote and be represented. I cannot imagine being a US citizen, paying taxes, and not having my voice heard. It seems to me we fought a war with another country a couple centuries back over such issues… Maybe  some Texas school book says otherwise, but the schoolbooks I read, and  the books I have in my library say we did.

    • http://drewyoutoo.blogspot.com Drew You Too

      Nice! I’d be interested to here your thoughts on my above comment regarding using Biometrics. You seem open minded enough to realize that the voting problem would just be the tip of the iceberg in relation to other problems this would help address. I’d really like to know what you think, provided you could spare the time.

  • Cory

    The widest possible base of voters is the best medicine for democracy.  Finding ways to restrict voting is bad for democracy.

  • Pingback: Tune in to hear LWVUS President | League of Women Voters of the Elgin Area

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    Voters ID? another Red Tape just to vote.
    next time the government will be asking Fee’s to vote or donations to vote.

    That’s why I will never vote.

    • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

      Then you’re a part of the problem.  Or perhaps it’s good that you don’t vote. . .

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

        How can I be part of the problem when I don’t vote.
        You voted people who screw up the economy and voted for an incompetent president.

        How can I be part of the problem when I did not vote for those politicians that you actually vote.

        • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

          I didn’t vote for Obama, nor did I vote for McCain.  There were other choices, and if you do your work, you’d know that.  By not voting–in primaries and party elections, in addition to general elections–you’re letting the problems happen.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

            So you are the who is the part of the problem because you voted for Georgr W. Bush.

            President Obama never gave America A PROBLEM it was GWB.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Again, perhaps you ought to do a bit of study.  I didn’t vote for any Bush.  You apparently don’t know who ran in various elections.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

            Way A Minute if you didn’t vote for any Bush or Obama

            So you didn’t vote at all!!! Bush was in 8 office for 8 years and the next President is Obama.

            so you did not vote since GWB except for Clinton.

            You like to say something and you think I can’t catch you
            I don’t who ran in various elections. PLEASE!!!!!

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Have you heard of third parties?  Do you know who Bob Barr or Ralph Nader are?  In 2004, there was someone in a major party other than Bush or Obama.  There are your answers.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

            Yes but I don’t follow THEM you know why?

            They don’t have a lot of PUBLICITY or if they did it must be so little that I didn’t see them.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Yup, so that’s your excuse.  I’m glad that you don’t vote.

          • TFRX

            “Letting the problems happen” is a good phrase.

        • Modavations

          In a free country you have the right to abstain.Got your back lad.

  • M.E.

    Last year was my first year voting in Minnesota after voting in Massachusetts for the past 40 years. It was also the first time in my life that I was frightened going to the polls. I had been listening to radio reports of frivolous challenges to voters in other counties. When I got to the polls I noticed that people were showing their driver’s licenses upon entering. I did not show mine and it was not an issue. I was struck but not deterred by the anxiety voting caused because I am familiar with the issue but many people would be deterred.

    It is also a rumor in some circles here that one can avoid jury duty by not registering to vote. In fact, having a driver’s license makes one eligible for jury duty in Minnesota. There are some folks making less that $ 10 an hour who don’t vote for this reason.

    • Modavations

      Tell the lawyers. tedious testimony makes you fall asleep.

    • notafeminista

      No having a driver’s license does not make one eligible for jury duty.  It makes one more likely to be called as potential jurors are culled from voting and drivers’ license lists.  Motor/Voter?  Maybe you have heard of it? 

      Given the sort of popular pejorative that juries are made up of people not smart enough to figure out how to get out of jury duty, I suspect any number of wage earners both above and below $10 an hr figure out ways to get their names removed from those lists.

  • Charles A. Bowsher

     You/We need to get off our collective arses, get our friends off their collective arses, march to the local voter registration office and verify we are registered and where we are to vote. Do this now, before it is to late. I repeat what I have said in the past.
     
    “They may have all the money, but We have all the votes!”
     
    In Kentucky felons can vote if they get a waiver from the Governor after two years have passed since they were released from jail. Not a guarantee of restoration, but a chance at least and forces on the ground here are working diligently to get it changed to automatic restoration of rights after parole is fininshed successfully.

    • TFRX

      How hard does Kentucky work to make this known to ex-felons?

      In my state the SecState does their job. In other states, I don’t know.

      • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

        Why should a state have to work hard to get felons to vote?

        • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

          Why not they are part of the electorial process.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            They’ve proved themselves to be bad citizens and need to bring themselves back into good standing.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

            So all the voters are good citizen – that’s so BS.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            Doesn’t commit a felony equals good citizen, in that context.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

            It doesn’t mean you cannot vote.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            It means that and many other things.  Felons have to show that we can rely on them this time.

        • TFRX

          It is among the duties of the Secretary of State, where it is the case. In the vernacular, it’s their friggin’ job.

          In some states the SecState does everything they can to keep people ignorant about their voting rights. See Blackwell in Ohio–he’s an embarrassment to the office.

          Otherwise it’s akin to hiring a librarian who won’t help anyone who wants to use the library.

          • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

            if I’m a librarian, and a patron comes in who has stolen books before, you’re right, I’m going to be slow to assist that person.

          • TFRX

            Being a felon != (doesn’t equal) stealing library books.

            When it is the law, the SecState should do their frakking job.

            In some states, they just don’t.

  • Drew You Too

    Use biometric authentication (fingerprint, face recognition, DNA, Palm print, hand geometry, or iris recognition) in addition to requiring SSN input. Establish encryted tunnels to secured server(s) from voting terminals and you’re done. 1 Voter, 1 Vote. THAT is Democracy. While I don’t like the idea of everyone being submitted to Biometric Identification, we’re being submitted to it involuntarily anyway. Do some reading on facial recognition applications and implementation if you don’t believe me. And no Social Security Number? Sorry, no vote. Do this and watch how quick the Dog and Pony show will come to an end. There would still be some “inconvenience” in being registered initially but once it was done you would NEVER have to bear the “inconvenience” again. And if you consider the right to place an accurately tallied vote to be outweighed by any personal inconvenience you might encounter in the process, perhaps you should stay home.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Paolo-Caruso/1778940602 Paolo Caruso

    THERE ARE NO CREDIBLE CANDIDATES TO VOTE FOR.   The current system only
    produces billionaires, corporate stooges and corrupt clowns.

    • Anonymous

      This is a related but separate problem.

      There are no perfect candidates, but that is the nature of life.

      Neil

    • Drew You Too

      And this is new? It’s always been the lesser of the evils, railing about it accomplishes nothing aside from wasting bandwith.

    • Anonymous

      There’s still Bernie Sanders.  Of course, if you don’t live in Vermont, then you might have a point.

  • Modavations

    Acorn,Acorn,Acorn

    • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

      Squirrel!

      • Modavations

        Dude,I beat you to it.Put away the “ball peen”hammer.

      • Drew You Too

        Thanks, that made me smile. The political climate in this country is…SQUIRREL!!! What was I saying?

        • http://gregorycamp.wordpress.com/ Greg Camp

          It was a beautiful film, one that gives me hope for modern cinema.

        • Modavations

          How dare you say that.How dare you think that.

    • Cory

      Baloney, baloney, baloney.

  • Modavations

    Al Franken,Al Franken,Al Franken

  • Modavations

    Some one said California has banned E-Verify.It’s the same types,windging about Voter Registration.

  • Modavations

    NYT et al. recounted in Fl. and Bush won.If it had been the other way around,Republicans would similarly,be weeping to this day.

    • John in Amherst

      check your facts.  doubts remain.  And too bad the conservatives on the SCOTUS conservatives saw fit to abort the process before it could reach a conclusion

      • Modavations

        Signed off on by the NYT!!!!!Al Franken,Al Franken,Al Franken

        • John in Amherst

          you seem to like mantras, but they don’t seem to be giving you peace of mind.  And I’m guessing this is one of the few insatnces that you quote the NYT.  Also, check their analysis… 

          • Zing

            You’re the one crying

  • Modavations

    They said there were “road blocks”set up in Fl.to turn blacks away from the voting booths.They said people were giving erroneous voting booth locations,they said,they said….After extensive hearings, not a frigging claim was proven valid.

  • Modavations

    League of Womens Voters and “Now” are front groups for the Dem.Party.I’ll never forget the day someone posted(multiple times)that Ms.Bachman needed Sex Toys.Not one,I repeat,not one Liberated ,NPR Women,protested

    • John in Amherst

      Or perhaps they are front groups for the truth.  I for one find the Bachmann taunts despicable, and hardly representative of the views of NOW or LWV, whom you seek to malign by association with those posts.

      • Modavations

        It took “Now” NYC,ten days to answer why they hadn’t condemned Mr.Weener.They said,he voted their way.”Now Central”,after weeks of silence,said Mr.Clinton was entitled to one “grope”!!!!

      • Modavations

        The only complaint came from an old,professor type,who claimed he was ashamed at the intolerant,NPR name callers.

    • Beckycarr100

      League of Women Voters is nonpartisan. They don’t endorse parties or candidates. They adopt positions after studying issues and reaching consensus. I’m a member and I’ll say that comment about MB was reprehensible. She has also told a lot of reprehensible lies, however, so maybe anger at her for that was the root of the comment, but it was still off-base to say that.

      • Modavations

        I wasn’t born yesterday

      • Modavations

        Give me an example of a Liberal cause your organization hasn’t advocated for 

  • Modavations

    As a tax payer who generally pays over $30,000 in taxes,I have the right to abstain from voting and have done so.The only vote I have ever casted ,was for Perot

    • Anonymous

      Are you proud of this?  Why does your income or the amount of taxes you pay matter in this discussion?

      Neil

      • Modavations

        Read the earlier post of Mr.Caruso.

    • John in Amherst

      No, not as a taxpayer who pays whatever in taxes do you deserve the right to vote (or not).  It is as a citizen of the US, you have the right to vote.  As should all citizens, whether or not they have a drivers’ license or passport etc.  And if you are white, and look reasonably affluent, you probably wouldn’t even have to show an ID to vote, which is the point here. 

      • Modavations

        Tell that to the TSA

        • John in Amherst

          you do know that the TSA was a Bush legacy, and the TSA is not in charge of voter security, right?
          Is your pique due to the fact that you are white and afluent and someone at the TSA DID still bothered to check you?  The Gall!

    • Drew You Too

      I’d be careful about pointing out that you pay more in taxes than many Americans currently make in annual income. It may make you feel “special” but as the old proverb states: The nail that sticks out is the first to get hammered.

      Things are beginning to change, you might won’t to look up and take in the view.

      • TFRX

        Your remarks are commonsensical, but as far as prospecting for a real-world conversation, you’re pumping a dry hole here.

        • Drew You Too

          And the majority of the comments here are directed towards affecting a real change?

      • John in Amherst

        30K in taxes may mean this guy is someone making 90k, paying income taxes, prop., sales & excise taxes, etc., or it could be someone who makes considerably more who is skilled at gaming the system for loopholes, write-offs, etc. Now I’m not a gambler, but…. 

        • Modavations

          I was a Croupier for many years.The last thing Ma. needs, are casinos.Cut the spending and drop the taxes.Like in Perry’s Texas

          • John in Amherst

            Totally agree that no place needs more casinos. 
            While we’re all dropping taxes like Perry did in TX, shall we also lower wages, health care coverage for kids, lower  educational achievement, & trash the enviroment like Perry did?  While countries like China, Japan, Germany, the Nordic nations invest in infrastucture, citizens’ health and education, the GOP see fit only to spend on the military.  We are on a track that leads either to the US becoming second rate in terms of productivity and quality of life, or attempting to fight it out on a real (as opposed to figurative) battlefield to maintain our unsustainable standard of living large as it increasingly slips out of reach of more and more of our citizens.

          • Modavations

            Texas produced more jobs then the whole country combined.The Welfare state has been an abysmal failure.Prez.Obama said Sunday, that the 5 Trillion war on poverty, is a failure.School Vouchers please.The average family pays $100,000 for Medicare and takes 300,000 out!!!

          • John in Amherst

            you neglected to answer whether you would also like to follow the TX model for child health care, education, wages, environment etc.  The jobs created in TX are due in part to the increase in population, and most are primarily low wage, no benefit jobs.  Perry has followed Bush in remodeling the Tx economy along the lines of third world banana republic.

      • Modavations

        If that’s the case,sue your public school and college ,for malfeasance.

  • Modavations

    Trwx,Jeffe,Ultrax,NJ….Let me do it for you.You can’t say that,how dare you think that.

  • Modavations

    CNN and Donna Brazile are doing the same story.Mr.Ashbrook ,are you coordinating with the Dem.Party,or any of their agents?

    • John in Amherst

      You mean like FOX works hand in glove w/ the GOP, to the point of employing several of the GOP candidates?  Too bad the story is big enough news to warrant coverage by more than one source, eh?

      • Modavations

        Half the country is right wing and we pay for half of NPR.When,o when,will we get a Laissez Faire type, hosting an NPR show.

        • John in Amherst

           laisez fair = right wing idealogue?
          BTW, my NPR station relies on member contributions for about 90% of its budget.

          • Modavations

            CPR gets about 400mill(?),in.tax payer money ,per annum.How many poor people listen to NPR,or go to the Opera.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    I don’t VOTE but I BLAME the people who voted for George W. Bush.
    You people voted for a very incompetent President who had only one AGENDA in his Presidency to make a lot of MONEY FROM OIL.

    That was his main goal to be President and passed the Patriot’s Act to Hijacked our civil liberty.

    • Beckycarr100

      You don’t have the right to blame anyone if you’re eleigle to vote and don’t.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

        That’s why I don’t vote there is no Guarantee if the person I voted can solve America’s problems.

  • Gregg

    If it were up to me, all the primaries would be on one day. Super-duper Tuesday.

    • Modavations

      Let’s get rid of the D and R’s beside the politicians name.Democrats would vote in Stalin and Mousillini if you put “D”next to their names

      • TrollAlert

        How many times are you going to use the same spiteful comments.  You are provocateur and should be ignored and isolated as well as your other moniker – ArnoldWalker.

         

        • Modavations

          How dare you stimulate contrary thought.I am the Thought Police and I forbid you to express that opinion

        • Modavations

          The guys in N.Carolina thought they were voting for Al Greene the singer.

  • Modavations

    Prez Obama just said the 5 trillion spent on the” war on Poverty” was a failure.The plight of the poor is as bad as it was 50 years ago.Mr.Obama,the Dem.Party is rascist to the bone.The Plantation is intentional.And what is your proof Sn.Modavtions?The absolute antipathy of the Left,to School Vouchers.

  • Modavations

    Did you ever wonder why England refused to give up the Pound?

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      Because they don’t like dollars.

  • Drew You Too

    Requiring photo ID’s will not affect voting fraud. Only an irrefutable proof of your identity will do that, and even then there’s still going to be the hurdles created by convoluted ballots, rigged voting machines, manipulated districts, and last but not least the electoral college. Want it to change? Want to do something about it? See my previous comment.

    • Modavations

      Politicsis non violent warfare.Like playing chess.Your move senor.

      • Drew You Too

        I don’t feed trolls.

  • Modavations

    What’s all this antisemetism I keep hearing from The NYC,Wall Street protesters.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      Did you really hear it or the Media mentioned it?

    • TrollAlert

      You
      are ‘paid troll’ and a provocateur and should be ignored and isolated as well as your
      other moniker – ArnoldWalker.
       

      • Modavations

        Don’t think that.Don’t say that.

  • Modavations

    Ms Sibelius just threw out half of Obama Care.To quote Ms.Pelosi,you have to pass the bill,to know what’s in the bill.

  • Malcom Digest

    It’s a bit disingenuous to keep saying “No one has proven that there is fraud” and “There have been zero convictions” when the current policies make it impossible to measure. How can anyone honestly say they know that it isn’t happening when they won’t allow people to match faces and IDs of the person who shows up to vote against a list of registered voters? (Question for those against voter ID laws: there’s very little evidence of voter intimidation and practically zero convictions, would you support eliminating private booths and secret ballots? If not, then why are you against voter ID?)

    It’s kind of like saying that you can’t prove that any money was stolen in a robbery because you won’t let anyone look into the cash register to see how much money is missing.

    Regardless of your political leanings the right to vote is important enough that you should want the system to have as much integrity as possible and voters should be as engaged as possible.

    • Vendetta73

      I do want the system to have integrity; I just think that widespread participation is at least as important to the integrity of a vote as the elimination of fraud, especially when there IS no evidence of fraud.  So since the danger of raising obstacles to voting is tangible, and the threat of fraud unsubstantiated, I’m inclined to worry more about the first. 

      Look, if there were masses of people showing up and voting as some other registered voter, wouldn’t those registered voters file complaints when they in turn showed up and were listed as already having voted?  Even with our country’s abysmal turnout rates, it would have to happen pretty frequently if fraud were widespread.  It’s like kind of like saying you can’t prove that any money was stolen in a robbery just because the store owner says nothing’s missing, and no one reported a robbery or called the police.

      • Drew You Too

        What difference does it make how many voters show up if their electoral representative decides that they are not informed enough to make an educated decision once the process nears the finish line?

      • Malcom Digest

        Voter ID laws do much more than prevent people from voting as someone else. Primarily they are a requirement if you intend to enforce existing voting law. And of course fraud is unsubstantiated, the mechanisms required to identify fraud are fought against by, well, you.

        Additionally there are other benefits of voter ID laws. For example in the Washington 2004 governors election days after the election ballots were being “found” and presented for counting. In the end there were more ballots cast than registered voters and the marginal of victory was smaller than the number of cast ballots. One issue the Washington Supreme court identified was that they could not identify which ballots were invalid. So they counted them all. If there were names associated with polling places and ballot batches you could discard entire batches and have those specific individuals revote, thereby eliminating the bogus ballots.

        And in the analogy, the point is that the owner is saying there was a robbery and they did report it to the police. But the courts are saying they need evidence and the people who are, apparently, pro-robbery insist on preventing any evidence collection.

        My position is that I want everyone who is eligible to vote to do so and everyone who is not eligible to not do so. Voter ID laws make this possible. If someone too apathetic and so uninvolved in the process that they cannot meet minimal requirements, then they are choosing not to vote. They are not being prevented from voting.

    • Anonymous

      Interesting. I spoke with a couple of college professors (International Business), one Bulgarian and the other German. Both were amazed that the US **doesn’t** require PhotoID at the polls, which they interpreted as a lack of respect for the sanctity of the process. Canada, by the way, absolutely requires PhotoID in all elections. In the States, you need PhotoID  to get a library card. So what’s the big deal?

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    The Florida election was a Fraud but AL Gore seceded.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      Even if you only counted the votes that actually made it through the hoops in order to be cast, the president was really Al Gore.

      • Drew You Too

        BOTH Florida Elections which resulted in eight of the darkest years in policy decisions were frauds. Read about the Supreme Court ruling related to the first one (2000). Even had the opposing candidate not backed down, the Supreme Court basically said “The media said he’s president, he says he’s president, we don’t care what the actual vote tally says.

        • Gregg

          Bush won fair and square. Get over it.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    Democracy is only an experiment in government, and it has the obvious disadvantage of merely counting votes instead of weighing them.

    • Drew You Too

      In weighing votes you imply that you (the weigher) should have more impact in determining the outcome than the voters. Why? Because you’re special?

      And this experiment is rapidly approaching becoming a failed one, to the detriment of us ALL (not just those you consider to be the least among us).

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

        William R. Inge – You ask him Mr. Drew You Too. he was the one who said it.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    It is a sign of the times that the absence of meaningful ID requirements in many states leaves our voting process vulnerable to fraud and allows legal votes to be cancelled out by illegally cast ballots.

  • Eb3design

    I don’t think The Problem of Voting fraud is found in individual voting more than once or under false pretenses.  I think the problem is too few people actually
    vote at all. This is just another barrier to help reduce voting.  As it is only 56.8% in 2008 and 37.8% 2010 voted.  When it become 110% then we should go to biometrics.

     

    Real Voting Fraud are these barriers and at the counting of
    votes.

    • Drew You Too

      Real voting fraud is an individual beliving that their vote will count…for anything.

      Yes, let’s wait until after we’ve run the course that every other self professed “Great Civilization” that has come before us has gone down to aknowledge a problem and enact a change.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    In some other countries soldiers and civilian volunteers guard ballot boxes. Some die protecting ballot boxes, some sleep with them and some
    are chained to them.

    Votes are so precious in every democratic nations on earth.

  • Erica Wells

    For those wanting more info on the Voting issue: Please read Jane Mayer’s article in the Oct 10, 2011 issue of The New Yorker: “State for Sale: Art Pope’s conquest of North Carolina.” Pope is is close, long-time friend of the Koch Brothers, “a conservative multimillionaire, the Knight of the Right.” It is a chilling story and we should all be scared. These people have been working for decades, designing strategy, waiting, pouncing, more waiting, moving. They have laser focus, money, POWER, AND ENDLESS MONEY TO BUY MORE POWER.
    The Tea Party is the noise, purposely causing distraction, diverting attention, while the REAL WORK goes on quietly behind the scenes, until it is suddenly a fait accompli and ON the scene!

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      I thought New Yorker gone broke like Reader’s Digest.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    First, I think more Americans need to declare their independence from partisan politics on both sides. The more that Americans declare their independence, the more the parties will have to compete for their votes using reason rather than the hateful appeals.

  • Chris Barnett

    More info about Rhode Island’s new Voter ID law is posted on the Secretary of State’s website at http://sos.ri.gov/elections/voterid/.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    The votes of 60,000 Floridians were not counted. The Court threw out all 60,00 votes. And that’s what the newspapers around the country are counting now.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

      The Florida Supreme Court wanted all the legal votes to be counted. The United States Supreme Court, on the other hand, did not want all the votes to be counted.

      • Drew You Too

        That is precisely what I meant. Good looking out FAX68

        • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

          Sorry Drew with all Modavations comments I am dazed. thank you that we both know (and others) what happened in Florida.

      • Gregg

        Are you talking about 2000? Every court above and below ruled contrary to the FSC. Justice Sanders Saul had the whole thing wrapped up before they imposed themselves.

  • Lawyer

    The Constitution already has a remedy for these problems, Article 2 of the 14th Amendment. It has never been used because it has never had to be used, but it was designed to ensure that States didn’t take actions to disenfranchise voters after the Civil War. The 15th Amendment and civil rights legislation were much more specific, so the 14th Amendment remedy was never needed, but it is needed now.

    The remedy is this: If the election process disenfranchises people, those people do not count in the census that determines the number of representatives that State has in Congress. That means less power in the House of Representatives and less power in the Presidential election. If you can design protections that don’t disenfranchise voters, fine, otherwise, the Constitution proscribes the penalty for that.

    • Anonymous

      pffh.  if IDs are publicly available without charge- guess what?  your argument disappears

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_C2STBLZJK4VKQBV27DVQX3I6CU FAX68

    Flying Voters – is define when a voters that is already deceased is still voting in the Philippines.

  • Ulrichvonbeck

    I don’t think it makes any sense to address validating voters before addressing validating the voting machines themselves.  A Las Vegas slot machine is subject to more rigorous controls and inspections than a voting machine is.

  • WhoIsCounting

    “You know, comrades,” says Stalin, “that I think in regard to this: I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this — who will count the votes, and how.” 

  • WhoIsCounting

    “The difference between a democracy and a dictatorship is that in a democracy you vote first and take orders later; in a dictatorship you don’t have to waste your time voting.” – Charles Bukowski

  • WhoIsCounting

    “A democracy is two wolves and a small lamb voting on what to have for dinner. Freedom under a constitutional republic is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.” – Benjamin Franklin

  • AC

    wasn’t there recently a show on the history of voting? I remember laughing when they said the party mailed you your requested ballot on big colorful paper everyone saw you heading in to vote with. 
    but now I wonder, maybe that’s clever? 
    tho, i believe they mentioned that you had to vote with a bodyguard and a gun handy because people were paid to run up and steal your ‘ballot’ if it wasn’t the right color…or something…i forgot, maybe the show’s in archives somewhere….

    • TrollAlert

      You throw the diversionary dice very well on this site.

      Seen your work many times before.  If you didn’t show moments of lucidity, “the ditzy act” might almost even be believable.

      You even have the visual to back it up.  Nice work.

      • Anonymous

        apart from the bodyguard part, she’s right.  ballots used to be printed by the parties in the partisan press rather than by the state.  color coded ballots allowed people to vote without being able to read.  some of the papers that published the ballots also showed you whom to vote for.  there was fighting at the polling boxes to prevent people from voting the ‘right’ way for a particular precinct, and assault and beatings were common,  i remember reading an account of someone whose head was bashed in with a brick.  of course this was all in the 1800′s

  • WhoIsCounting

    “Voting machines used by as many as a quarter of American voters heading to the polls in 2012 can be hacked with just $10.50 in parts and an 8th grade science education, according to computer science and security experts…” 

    http://politics.salon.com/2011/09/27/votinghack/singleton

  • TheRealThreat

    The more significant problem is verifying the votes, not the voters.

    Headlining the show, “A War On Voting” is sensationalizing a lesser problem and whitewashing the real and greater threat behind ‘voter fraud’: electronic voting.

    Once again, On Point and (N)ational (P)ropaganda (R)adio are providing a smokescreen for the critical problem behind ‘voter fraud’.

    Why don’t they do some authentic journalism and interview Bev Harris of BlackBoxVoting.org to better inform their listeners of the opportunistic dangers of ‘electronic voting’ and the related evidence of electronic vote tampering?

    • Jeffe68

      You have to be kidding. Voter fraud is not a problem.
      People like you posting this kind absurd rhetoric and then posting a link to a right wing propaganda web site are the problem.

      • WhyWorry

        Here’s another ‘right wing propaganda web site’ for you:

        http://politics.salon.com/2011/09/27/votinghack/singleton

        “Why worry?

        The BRAD BLOG has been warning about the manipulation of e-voting systems for years, along with members of the world’s computer science and cyber security communities, and even the CIA, as our own Ernie Canning noted just last week. And yet, our nation continues to use the same vulnerable e-voting systems to tally our elections, rather than bothering to count them with our own, far more reliable and verifiable, hands and eyes, as per Democracy’s Gold Standard.

        I could link back to all sorts of e-voting hacks we’ve reported on over the years here, like this one from Princeton in 2006 or this one from the U. of MI in 2010 or this bone-chilling warning from the CIA in 2009, but they’ll mostly likely just be ignored. Again.”

        http://www.bradblog.com/?p=8785

        http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5971

        http://bradblog.com/?p=6043
         

      • BlackBox

        Here’s another article from a ‘right wing propaganda web site’:

        “Electronic voting machines in Florida may have awarded George W. Bush up to 260,000 more votes than he should have received, according to statistical analysis conducted by University of California, Berkeley graduate students and a professor, who released a study on Thursday.”

        http://www.wired.com/politics/security/news/2004/11/65757

      • Corsi78

        Just because you say so, does not make it so.  Open minded, right thinking people know it is a problem.  It must be addressed.

  • guest

    Ok – no matter where you fall on this issue, you have to admit that it’s completely unfair to say the GOP is the ONLY party redrawing the lines. If you’re going to look at NC, you also have to look at Illinois! 

  • Bob

    I find it ironic that Republicans who want to deregulate things for corporations are putting more regulations on the LWV and older/poorer Americans

    • Anonymous

      and is it not equally ironic that the Dems who usually are for more regulation are against it when the GOP happens to support it?

  • Hidan

    Wow the guy for discriminating minorities to get those imaginary voter fraudster got owned today. Kind of felt bad for a few seconds.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_DUPPBMFPVZXG5764CU476PHW7Y cah1470

    I think it’s a shame we are so divided that even the simplest of things has “two sides”. Frankly if there aren’t any real cases of voter fraud then one can’t argue that the reason for more controls or tighter restrictions is to prevent fraud. I can’t remember a time where voter participation was even as high as 20% but I am supposed to believe 84 cases of voter fraud out of less than 15% voter participation is a reason for new laws and restrictions? I live in N.C. my father is one of those african americans who was born at home and has an affadavit instead of a birth certificate. He is also a tax payer who worked for Overnight for 40 years. One of his proudest days was being able to vote for our president in 2008 and I think he earned that right and he shouldn’t have to worry about anyone infringing on it.

  • crt

    So we don’t require an ID to vote and prove who you are but we know voter fraud is not an issue….And we know this how?

    • Anonymous

      There is voter identification at my polling station — I’ve been going there for 19 years and the poll workers know me.

      What about another voting security: how do we know that electronic voting machines count votes correctly?  How do we know that databases are not hacked, or otherwise manipulated?  If the vote counting is being handled by people with strong party affiliations with no transparency?

      Neil

    • WeKnowThisHow

      “More generally, there seems to be little statistical basis for the Republican fixation on voter fraud. The few studies that have been done show fraud to be insignificant to the outcome of elections; it has been measured at levels as low as .0004 percent (PDF) of all ballots cast. Loraine Minnite, an assistant professor of political science at Barnard College, conducted a study of elections from 1992 to 2002 for Demos, a London- and New York-based public-policy think tank. Her analysis of the numbers showed that “the incidence of election fraud in the United States is low and that fraud has had a minimal impact on electoral outcomes.” A 2006 report from the United States Election Assistance Commission, an independent agency created by Congress to “[conduct] research on election administration issues,” calls Minnite’s study the “most systematic look at fraud” (PDF).” 

      http://www.salon.com/2007/03/21/us_attorneys_2/

      • crt

        So liberals believe voter fraud does not exist. Understood.
        With out checking an id how do you know who is voting. I agree on the voting machines.

        • NotSoMuch

          No, rational people don’t believe ‘voter fraud’ exists because of the reason: ‘non-citizens are trying to vote and are swaying election results’.

          Critically thinking people know ‘voter fraud’ exists for more prevalent and obvious reasons.

          • Anonymous

            To be “rational” in this instance apparently means to agree with everything that ‘NotSoMuch’ says.

  • NotGoodEnoughInGermany

    Electronic Voting Machines Unconstitutional in Germany:

    “On March 3, 2009, the Federal Constitutional Court issued a decision that may prevent the use of electronic voting machines in future German elections…

    The Court held that the particular voting machines used in the election did not live up to the constitutional principle of transparency of elections, which requires that voting machines be safeguarded against potential manipulation or error through procedures that are understandable to the average citizen.”

    http://www.loc.gov/lawweb/servlet/lloc_news?disp3_l205401164_text

  • MIsha, NY

    Some countries, like Australia, define voting as a mandatory civic duty, not a right. Why wouldn’t we make everybody to vote too? At least it will force people (especially young people!) to engage in the political process and express their preferences.
    Misha

    • Beckycarr100

      Because it’s a free country, maybe?

      • Ippus

        It isn’t going to stay a free country if people let the GOP’s corporate lap-dogs cast our votes for us.

  • Jaakko

    There is no system or resources in place to check if a person registering to vote is actually a US citizen – all you need is a social security number (real or fake). Student IDs are also issued to foreign students.

    • SimpleQuestion

      So how many elections did you try to vote in when you were a non-citizen in America?

  • mk dlph

    if elections are stolen or influenced by $100,000.00 purging contracts or requirements to vote are because of partisan efforts  to “secure the Authenticity of the vote”, fine. Maybe just delay the implementation of such efforts for at least one election cycle and see WHO REMAINS IN OFFICE. Maybe things will stay the same, at least the citizens get a vote before it gets taken away.

  • Betty

    I have been trying to get a photo ID for a year. To get one in New York State (non-driver driver’s license), I need a Social Security Card (mine was stolen years ago). To get a Soc Security card, I need a photo ID. To get a passport, I need a photo ID. I’m stuck in a never-ending loop.

    • Beckycarr100

      Yours is a perfect illustration of why League of Women Voters opposes the voter ID laws that have been passed.

    • Anonymous

      Bollocks.  Get a copy of your birth certificate, proof of residence (utility bills going back a certain period) and some other things and you’re fine.  I’ve been through the process myself. Stop whining.

  • Damon S.

    This has the air of the WMD logic, there is a phantom voter fraud that a new set of registration rules is designed to prevent.  It seems that the lessons of the Iraq war have not been learned yet, if fraud is such a large issue then let the prosecutions commence, and let’s see the conviction rate.  

    Conversely, if we blindly accept the logic of voter fraud, then we need a clean slate.   All existing forms of voter identification should be voided, and all citizens should therefore be required to obtain a NEW voter registration ID (with photo) free of charge.   Since voting is a constitutionally encouraged right, the only manner to initiate new laws in a non-partisan manner is to universally apply them (which in this case, I believe means universally annoying).

  • Jaakko

    This is the ONLY country in the world, where we are required by law to provide services to people who are here illegally (medical, education etc.) - who also can register to vote just by providing a social security number (real or fake) – no-one checks. In all fairness many people may think that because they live in the US, they are elligible to vote as well - however, the issue whether they actually vote or not is irrelevant.

    One of the greatest miscarriages of the justice is the fact that we concentrate on voter ID issue potentially affecting a few who may not be able obtain a required ID, and totally ignore the processes which would allow our servicemen/women outside the US to cast their votes on a timely manner. 

    All of us have to be able prove who we are in the court of law – why not at the polling place? Utility bill, student ID etc. does not prove if one is a US citizen. Since a great majority of US citizens do not have a passport, the only solution is a national ID card.

    Originally, I came to the US as an exchange student from Finland (J-1 visa), and I was issued a (legal) Social Security number – and became permanent resident, still no right to vote, until I became a US citizen.

    • stevec

      I agree.  I am amazed how liberals complain about making voting harder.  Only when one with an old car tries to get it to pass emissions testing.  Now THAT is what you call difficult!!  Stop all the whining and making the ability to get my car to pass emissions so HARD!!  You liberals are unabashed hypocrites!!

      • VotebyCar

        That’s the answer… all you need is an emissions test to register and then show up to your polling place with the same vehicle when you vote.

      • Anonymous

        What does an emissions test have to do with voting or being liberal?
        If your car can’t pass inspection then maybe you should get it fixed so people who don’t have to breath the crap coming out of it.
        The nerve of some people.

        • Anonymous

          Duh- he’s saying that the left views making things more difficult as a problem only in those rare cases when the additional regulations don’t serve their interests.  

          • Anonymous

            Bull dung.

          • Anonymous

            w/e – the left has never had a problem with regulations that increase the difficulty of things so long as it serves ends they consider worthwhile.  if you’re not willing to even admit that then you’re just dishonest

    • LuckyFin

      So, how many non-citizens do you think it takes to throw an election in America?

      Your lucky, I know people who did the same things you did and couldn’t even get a green card in the US.

  • Corsi78

    Wow, this On Point report has to be the most propagandistic piece of @*#! masquerading as journalism I have ever seen.  The only people swayed by this propaganda are the shallow minded.  Only a mule cannot see that you leftists are now setting the stage for massive protests after the 2012 election when conservative Americans sweep you leftists out of office!  At that point you will scream that these “restrictions” are what caused you to lose that election.  Just mark my words and watch with open eyes …

    • Anonymous

      Wow, nice right wing extremism.

    • EyesWideOpen

      Massive protests? Like there were in 2000 and 2004?

      Must of missed them and those headlines.  

      Specifically, which ‘leftists’ are you talking about? 

      • Anonymous

        The ones who want to keep him and his ilk from turning this nation into a third world banana republic.

        • EyesWideOpen

          The banksters already set the process in motion. 

          Any elected candidate is not going to have much of an impact unless they get rid of them.

          I’d really hate to become a third-world Gap or Old Navy.

  • Trinakedspur

    This is an interesting approach when many EU countries are imposing fines on citizens for not voting.

    • FewNotMany

      As of March 2009:
      Luxembourg, Lichtenstein, Switzerland (only one canton – Schaffhausen),
      France (Senate only) and appearing to be the most strict – Belgium.

      I would say that’s a ‘few’ countries in the EU, not ‘many’.

      http://www.idea.int/vt/compulsory_voting.cfm

  • GMG

    I’m sorry, I’ve had it with these Republicans.  They will stop at nothing.  Voter fraud is not a problem, and, as usual, the lack of evidence is no barrier whatsoever.  They just manufacture opinions among the faithful to fit their agenda, and it makes it to the top of the national discussion without the evidence even being discussed.  It’s time to fight back against this mendacious idiocy, they are playing with fire, and the next thing you know this kind of misinformation could even get us into an unnecessary war.  Oh wait, they did that already.

    • LeavingAnythingOut

      Voting Fraud is a problem:

      Rigged electronic voting machines without a paper trail, missing or miss counted ballots, confusing or misprinted ballots, manipulated or missing voter rolls, voter precinct intimidation, broken or malfunctioning voting machines, voting day misinformation and redistricting.

      • GMG

        I agree totally.  I mean to refer to “voter fraud” – fraudulent activity on the part of voters — in contrast to “election fraud” — fraud on the part of people running the elections.  The latter is truly a big problem, as the anomalies in Florida, 2000 and Ohio 2004 indicate.

  • L.H.

    Very unfortunate, but REALITY is we live in a time of the Most Rampant levels of FRAUD in history. Based on this alone, it should be apparent proving U.S. Citizenship to vote is now more neccessary than any other time in our history.
    Our life, our liberties, and our government are already under extreme influence, from NON-CITIZENS. Understanding that much of this influence is INTENDED to be DETRIMENTAL, it is truly SCARY INDEED that even ONE PERSON, a NON-CITIZEN; can so easilly register and vote.

    VOTING isn’t only “A RIGHT” we as U.S. citizens have. It is a RESPONSIBILTY to personally be proactive in assuring the life and liberty we enjoy continues. It has after all, literally been paid for with the blood of so many since even BEFORE our “Declaration of Independence”.

    If ANY PARTIES, be it from a “Partisan Perspective” or not, are concerned that legitimate citizens cannot vote because of difficulty in proving citizenship; then these individuals should FOCUS their ENERGIES to make sure these citizens get “Any and All Assitance” they may need to acquire “Proof of Citizenship” identification required to vote.

    Spending energies to remove serious “Proof of Citizenship” requirements
    is borderline “Subversion Against the Citizens of the U.S.”. At the very least they are wanting to take an “Easy Way Out” for promoting their own political directions while showing no concern the negative effects Non-Citizen voting has on our democarcy.

    EVERY LEGITIMATE U.S. CITIZEN SHOULD VOTE —all effort should be made to assure it is possible for us to do so; just as all effort be made to prevent (as much as possible) NON-CITIZEN voting.

    • CapitalizeOnFear

      Where is your evidence that non-citizen ‘voter fraud’ is such an apparent issue?

      How many non-citizens do you think actually vote?

      What detrimental effect would it have, even if they did?

      How is this supposed ‘extreme influence’ ‘intended to be critical’ and why do you find it so ‘truly scary’?

      Where are you getting these fear-mongering ideas from?

       

    • Anonymous

      I’m shaking in my shorts. Talk about a “Partisan Perspective” or should I say “Paranoid Perspective”, boy do you ever have one. Non-citizens can’t vote if they could my ex would have years ago. 

    • Mudbugsoup

      These new restrictive voting laws disproportionately affect folks who tend to vote Democratic. I have seen no evidence that these new laws are necessary. In Tennessee, the documents required for the new photo ID are the same as was previously required to register to vote. And you can vote by absentee without the photo ID. Its a cure looking for a problem, and is most likely a conspiracy to skew elections in favor of the Republicans. They hate to lose, and as McConnell stated very early in Obama’s presidency…’our primary goal is to make sure Obama is a one term president.’ That is an indicator as to what we can expect from his party…

  • Jplhaupt

    The real potential for election fraud is through computer manipulation. There is evidence that this was the reason for Ohio’s unexpected late-night Republican swing in the 2004 presidential election that resulted in Bush’s victory. See http://freepress.org/departments/display/19/2011/4239 for a synopsis.

  • Non-Issue

    Statistics and causation prove non-citizens voting is a non-issue. 

    It barely makes a difference when citizens vote. 

    The agenda behind all of this is probably more of an excuse to float a ‘national id’ concept again.

  • Drew You Too

    Requiring photo ID’s will not affect voting fraud. Only an irrefutable proof of your identity will do that, and even then there’s still going to be the hurdles created by convoluted ballots, rigged voting machines, manipulated districts, and last but certainly not least the electoral college. Use biometric authentication (fingerprint, face recognition, DNA, Palm print, hand geometry, or iris recognition) in addition to requiring SSN input. Establish encryted tunnels to secured server(s) from voting terminals and you’re done. 1 Voter, 1 Vote. THAT is Democracy. While I don’t like the idea of everyone being submitted to Biometric Identification, we’re being submitted to it involuntarily anyway. Do some reading on facial recognition applications and implementation if you don’t believe me. And no Social Security Number? Sorry, no vote. Do this and watch how quick the Dog and Pony show will come to an end. There would still be some “inconvenience” in being registered initially but once it was done you would NEVER have to bare the “inconvenience” again. And if you consider the right to place an accurately tallied vote to be outweighed by any personal inconvenience you might encounter in the process, perhaps you should stay home. But, if we addressed these issues then we wouldn’t have all this great fun sitting around playing He said She said or the wonderful Lefty-Righty game. WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!

  • GMG
  • Drew You Too

    *sigh* What’s the point…

  • VoteAtYourOwnRisk

    Re-post:

    Voting ‘fraud’ is a problem because of…

    (Please, feel free to add to the list):

    Possibly rigged electronic voting machines
    Error prone electronic voting without receipt
    E-voting with no transparency or validation
    Hackable electronic voting systems
    Missing or miss-counted ballots
    Confusing or
    misprinted ballots
    Manipulated or missing voter registration rolls
    Precinct
    intimidation of voters
    Broken or malfunctioning mechanical voting machines
    Voting day
    misinformation
    Redistricting
    Lack of oversight and enforcement

    (‘A non-citizen trying to vote’ doesn’t even occur to me.)

    ps: Candidates always lying about their promises.
     

  • d’Arcy

    As Click and Clack would say, “B-o-o-o-o-o-GUS”!** “Ari” gets a Pinocchio award with clusters for his claim that Voter ID acts are passed only by Republicans. In our state a Democratic governor signed the law, although I think it was a mixed legislature at that time.** Not many cases of voting fraud were prosecuted? So what? Could be the prosecutors had more important cases on their dockets. Maybe many of the “irregularities” turned out to be stupidity rather than cupidity. I’ve heard that in Detroit only about half of murders are prosecuted; are the cops and prosecutors going to take time out to investigate an election abuse that probably wouldn’t have affected the result?** Part of our voter ID law at the same time made it easier to register. Instead of doing it through the Clerks’ offices it’s now done through the motor vehicle division.** It is totally appropriate that the state ensure that each person registering to vote is actually eligible to vote in the district and precinct inn which he or she registers. This includes the “homeless” people mentioned on the program. There was at one time a distinct problem here with college students registering in their college town and voting both there and in their “home” town; difficult enough to check for in-state students, almost impossible to check for out-of-staters. ** To me, the most annoying thing about it is being asked for ID by an election official who is a person I know personally, someone who greets me by name on the street and when I walk into the polling place, someone who would know without the ID if I were attempting to vote as another person or vice-versa.** It is also interesting that the people whining the loudest about ID laws here are the same ones who come on NPR and agonize over whether elections in – choose a country, France, Italy, Uganda, Pakistan … — are “free and fair”. But try to guard against election fraud here and you’re an ogre out to steal someone’s “rights”.

    • TrollAlert

      Nice troll action above: 

      Throw out about a dozen or so non-related comments with no clear line of reasoning, with just a smattering of realistic pretension to make them sound genuine – like they are actually from a ‘regular’ person.

      Believable?  I think not.

      One fallacy after another with asterisks in between.

      Nice touch… but totally bogus. 

    • Mudbugsoup

      IMHO a great deal of the angst is over the potential for partisan voter obstruction. It has happened before. Free and Fair is what it should be about. No system is perfect, but when you address some theoretical need for restrictive voting by using the whole Acorn thing, you lose me. I would not trust anything pushed by Republican legislatures, especially when it comes to ‘rights’. Both parties have a propensity for skullduggery, but the Republicans take the cake. They cannot stand to lose and will stoop to some very low levels to try and insure that won’t happen.

  • Pingback: On Point Covers GOP War on Voting | Herding Donkeys

  • Richard Joseph Daley

    Ari Berman believes in the old Democratic motto of voting early and often. Why not go back to Chicago rules and allow Democrat’s to pay for votes. Sounds fair to me. Why stop at that, you could follow that up with another Democratic ploy of registering deceased voters. Chicago rules, I say why not!

  • Bin

    You guys just don’t get it. The corporate owners and executives do NOT want you to vote. They KNOW what is good for you. They do not want you to waste valuable work time going to polls or anything like that. As to those who do not or cannot work – don’t worry, those behind the GOP have a plan for them too…

  • Pingback: Repeal, Serve, & Monitor: Fight Back Against Voter Suppression : Tennessee Citizen Action

  • Acirot

    Every effort should be to make voting possible for all citizens.   I am baffled by the destruction of democracy in the USA.   Shame, shame, shame.     Pat I   in California

  • Carmenbobsaint

    The party of “no” has the money, since corporations are now “persons” and this party will continue to hinder rights to voting through any means at their disgression. They once called democrats “unpatriotic”. It would appear they are the ones attempting to destroy democracy for all. Maybe there should be re-education of the “right” on patriotism.

  • Anonymous

    Well hell, let’s not get in the way of people voting at all.  I mean, if giving evidence that you are who you say you are is too much of an imposition, I guess that we should end voter registration too.

  • Anonymous

    That’s the stupidest comment on here.  

  • Anonymous

    I’m with Greg.  The info should be out there for those who want it.  They don’t need to waste money on advertising when anyone can look something up in a library if they care to take the time.  

  • Anonymous

    Having the right to abstain is one thing (I agree on that point), but whether not bothering to vote makes you part of the problem at a time when our politics are so screwed up- that’s a different matter entirely.

  • Anonymous

    Oh noes!  I have to get an ID even though I don’t drive.  I’m discriminated against.  Get real.

  • Anonymous

    hardly the same given that you are not required to vote

  • Anonymous

    you’re forgetting that many states also prevent felons from running for office and that sex offenders are often required to register themselves as such forever.  your notion of having ‘paid up’ is quaint but wrong

  • Anonymous

    because if you want deregulation most of the time, but regulation in order to prevent the sabotage of the democratic process, that apparently makes you unprincipled. if you’re usually for more regulation but against it when it might hurt your electoral prospects, then you’re what- principled?!

  • Anonymous

    let me guess: liberal democrat who doesn’t care about enforcing the law as long as his party benefits in the polls

  • Anonymous

    no- anyone can get an ID; you’re just pointing out that it may be difficult, that’s not the same

  • Anonymous

    so now it’s come down to it: your real complaint is against the hassle of going to the DMV.  wow.  that’s not much of an argument

ONPOINT
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Jul 25, 2014
Pallbearers carry a coffin out of a military transport plane during a ceremony to mark the return of the first bodies, of passengers and crew killed in the downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17, from Ukraine at Eindhoven military air base, Eindhoven, Netherlands, Wednesday, July 23, 2014. (AP)

Secretary of State Kerry to Israel. Obamacare back in the courts. Mourning as remains of Malaysia Flight 17 victims come home. Our weekly news roundtable goes behind the headlines.

Jul 25, 2014
Guest Renee McLeod of Somerville, MA's Petsi pies shows off her wares. (Robin Lubbock / WBUR)

There is nothing more American than a piece of pie. We taste and talk pies.

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Jul 25, 2014
Guest Renee McLeod of Somerville, MA's Petsi pies shows off her wares. (Robin Lubbock / WBUR)

There is nothing more American than a piece of pie. We taste and talk pies.

 
Jul 25, 2014
Pallbearers carry a coffin out of a military transport plane during a ceremony to mark the return of the first bodies, of passengers and crew killed in the downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17, from Ukraine at Eindhoven military air base, Eindhoven, Netherlands, Wednesday, July 23, 2014. (AP)

Secretary of State Kerry to Israel. Obamacare back in the courts. Mourning as remains of Malaysia Flight 17 victims come home. Our weekly news roundtable goes behind the headlines.

On Point Blog
On Point Blog
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In the odd chance that our pie hour this week made you hungry — how could it not, right? — we asked our piemaking guests for some of their favorite pie recipes. Enjoy!

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